Thread - LMI November Sudoku Test

@ 2010-11-03 3:51 PM (#2391 - in reply to #2390) (#2391) Top

purifire

Posts: 460

Country : India

purifire posted @ 2010-11-03 3:51 PM

purifire - 2010-11-03 3:30 PM

Thanks Zafer...

The explanation is indeed helpful :) Looking forward to the test..

Rishi

solved the example on LM Germany and it was really a great puzzle.. :)

Rishi

@ 2010-11-03 3:52 PM (#2392 - in reply to #2389) (#2392) Top

zhergan

Posts: 32

Country : Turkey

zhergan posted @ 2010-11-03 3:52 PM

Minfang Lin - 2010-11-03 3:11 PM

Chinese version is available on http://www.sudokufans.org.cn/forums/index.php?showtopic=125
if you want to play examples online, click the image of puzzle on the left. ( please use IE7/8 or Chrome)

for Chinese translation. It is also very good that the examples may be played online

I tried also playing in Firefox and I can say there was no problem also in Firefox

Regards,

Zafer

@ 2010-11-03 4:50 PM (#2393 - in reply to #2391) (#2393) Top

zhergan

Posts: 32

Country : Turkey

zhergan posted @ 2010-11-03 4:50 PM

purifire - 2010-11-03 3:51 PM

solved the example on LM Germany and it was really a great puzzle.. :)

Rishi

Hi Rishi,

for your kind words

I'm glad you liked it. I wish you will also enjoy the actual
puzzle during the test.

Zafer

@ 2010-11-03 8:36 PM (#2394 - in reply to #2376) (#2394) Top

vopani

Posts: 739

Country : India

vopani posted @ 2010-11-03 8:36 PM

In the note for Shifted Sudoku, it says 'The numbers 1~6 must not occur in standard 2x3 boxes'. 'Must not occur' or 'May not occur'?

@ 2010-11-03 9:26 PM (#2397 - in reply to #2394) (#2397) Top

zhergan

Posts: 32

Country : Turkey

zhergan posted @ 2010-11-03 9:26 PM

Hi Rohan,

It is actually stated that
"In the example numbers 1~6 is occured once inside standard 2x3 blocks. But it is not a MUST. Therefore there may be some duplicating digits inside these 2x3 standard blocks for 6x6 shifted sudoku (and 3x3 standard blocks for 9x9 shifted sudoku)".

In order to clearify this note I'll try to prepare a 6x6 shifted sudoku with renban groups in which there exist duplicating digits inside 2x3 standard blocks and try to share it here soon.

Regards,

Zafer

@ 2010-11-04 2:00 AM (#2399 - in reply to #2397) (#2399) Top

zhergan

Posts: 32

Country : Turkey

zhergan posted @ 2010-11-04 2:00 AM

Here comes my new 6x6 shifted sudoku design.

Regards,

Zafer

(shiftedsudwithrbgex2.JPG)

Attachments
----------------

shiftedsudwithrbgex2.JPG (18KB - 8 downloads)

@ 2010-11-04 8:25 AM (#2400 - in reply to #2394) (#2400) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2010-11-04 8:25 AM

Rohan Rao - 2010-11-03 8:36 PM

In the note for Shifted Sudoku, it says 'The numbers 1~6 must not occur in standard 2x3 boxes'. 'Must not occur' or 'May not occur'?

Rohan, it is "May not occur".
It is basically a Toroidal Sudoku with special shapes of 2X3 or 3X3 blocks. [ So it should be much easier than a toroidal sudoku ]

Zafer, thanks for uploading another example.

@ 2010-11-04 11:12 AM (#2401 - in reply to #2400) (#2401) Top

vopani

Posts: 739

Country : India

vopani posted @ 2010-11-04 11:12 AM

Ok. Got it. Thanx Zafer and Deb.

Looking forward to this test :-)

@ 2010-11-04 1:09 PM (#2402 - in reply to #2399) (#2402) Top

zhergan

Posts: 32

Country : Turkey

zhergan posted @ 2010-11-04 1:09 PM

Hi to all. Here comes the answer of my second 6x6 shifted sudoku example. You can see the duplicating digit or digits inside the standard 2x3 blocks.

Spoiler: show

Thanks Deb for your help on spoiler usage.

Regards,

Zafer

Edited by zhergan 2010-11-04 1:15 PM

@ 2010-11-09 2:11 AM (#2432 - in reply to #2402) (#2432) Top

gramar

Posts: 9

Country : United Kingdom

gramar posted @ 2010-11-09 2:11 AM

I'm looking forward to this one and have managed to complete all the 6 x 6s in the instruction booklet apart from one - the Symmetric Unequal Sudoku. I expect I'm missing something really obvious but I can't work out which cells are 180 degrees symmetric to each other.

Can anyone try and explain it to me please? Thanks.

@ 2010-11-09 2:36 AM (#2434 - in reply to #2432) (#2434) Top

zhergan

Posts: 32

Country : Turkey

zhergan posted @ 2010-11-09 2:36 AM

Hi,

In the symmetric unequal sudoku cells that are 180° symmetric to each other
cannot have same digits.

Keeping in mind that R corresponds to row and C corresponds to column; If
we talk about 6x6 R[n]C[k] can never have the same digit as R[7-n]C[7-k]
all n, k from 1 to 6 and if we consider 9x9 this time R[n]C[k] can never
have the same digit as R[10-n]C[10-k] for all n, k from 1 to 9 (of course
not both 5 same time).

Try to apply this rule once. You'll see it works. Hope it is more clear now.

Regards,

Zafer

@ 2010-11-09 2:41 AM (#2435 - in reply to #2434) (#2435) Top

zhergan

Posts: 32

Country : Turkey

zhergan posted @ 2010-11-09 2:41 AM

And who are interested about symmetric unequal sudoku may try to solve my 9x9 example on LM Germany site with the following address:

http://www.logic-masters.de/Raetselportal/Raetsel/zeigen.php?id=000...

It is not a hard one also. You may try it as an exercise.

Zafer

@ 2010-11-09 3:38 AM (#2436 - in reply to #2435) (#2436) Top

gramar

Posts: 9

Country : United Kingdom

gramar posted @ 2010-11-09 3:38 AM

Yes - I've got it now! Thanks for taking the time to reply - I've never come across this sudoku variant before. It's always great to come across a new puzzle type so I will go and try out the 9 x 9 now!

Regards. Christine

@ 2010-11-09 8:47 AM (#2437 - in reply to #2435) (#2437) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2010-11-09 8:47 AM

Some more Symmetric Unequal Sudokus from our older tests (without renban constraints)

From Classic Look Alikes

Click here to solve online

From Classic Look Alikes

Click here to solve online

from Mock 12

Click here to solve online

from Mock 12

Click here to solve online

@ 2010-11-09 1:11 PM (#2443 - in reply to #2377) (#2443) Top

lmunira

Posts: 8

Country : India

lmunira posted @ 2010-11-09 1:11 PM

Hi,
I cannot see any link to the IB for the test. Is there something that I am missing?
Munira.

@ 2010-11-09 1:17 PM (#2445 - in reply to #2443) (#2445) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2010-11-09 1:17 PM

lmunira - 2010-11-09 1:11 PM

Hi,
I cannot see any link to the IB for the test. Is there something that I am missing?
Munira.

If you are using a small screen computer, please scroll towards your right.
We are having this problem for a while now. High time we get it fixed :-)

@ 2010-11-09 1:37 PM (#2446 - in reply to #2445) (#2446) Top

lmunira

Posts: 8

Country : India

lmunira posted @ 2010-11-09 1:37 PM

Thanks,
Have got it. Silly of me.
Munira.

@ 2010-11-10 1:51 AM (#2451 - in reply to #2376) (#2451) Top

Pyrrhon

Country : Germany

Pyrrhon posted @ 2010-11-10 1:51 AM

Renban is a puzzle type invented (so far as I know) by Inaba Naoki. You can find his examples at http://inabapuzzle.com/honkaku/renban.html . (All digits occur in each row and column, all cages are renban groups.)

The oldest sudoku variant with renban groups is Hanidoku ( http://www.hanidoku.com/ ).

Other renban at http://www.sachsentext.de/en/node/1156 and other hanidoku at http://www.sachsentext.de/en/taxonomy/term/162 .

Pyrrhon

@ 2010-11-10 11:55 AM (#2452 - in reply to #2451) (#2452) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2010-11-10 11:55 AM

Pyrrhon - 2010-11-10 1:51 AM

Renban is a puzzle type invented (so far as I know) by Inaba Naoki. You can find his examples at http://inabapuzzle.com/honkaku/renban.html . (All digits occur in each row and column, all cages are renban groups.)

The oldest sudoku variant with renban groups is Hanidoku ( http://www.hanidoku.com/ ).

Other renban at http://www.sachsentext.de/en/node/1156 and other hanidoku at http://www.sachsentext.de/en/taxonomy/term/162 .

Pyrrhon

Thank you for sharing history of Renban. I'm sure this will be informative to many players.

Also, for those who don't know, Pyrrhon's website http://www.sachsentext.de contains list of many many Sudoku variants. You google for any Sudoku variant, and sachsentext.de is most likely to be in 1st page.

Thanks Uwe for maintaining such a wonderful website.

@ 2010-11-10 2:00 PM (#2453 - in reply to #2452) (#2453) Top

zhergan

Posts: 32

Country : Turkey

zhergan posted @ 2010-11-10 2:00 PM

debmohanty - 2010-11-10 11:55 AM

Thank you for sharing history of Renban. I'm sure this will be informative to many players.

Also, for those who don't know, Pyrrhon's website http://www.sachsentext.de contains list of many many Sudoku variants. You google for any Sudoku variant, and sachsentext.de is most likely to be in 1st page.

Thanks Uwe for maintaining such a wonderful website.

I also want to thank Uwe (aka Pyrrhon) for sharing information about Renban

. Some puzzlers may not be familiar with this subject. I also follow his great site http://www.sachsentext.de and learn about different variants

Uwe deals not only with sudokus and the site has a lot of different puzzle types also. But I know that solving Uwe's designs is always enjoyable. He shared some of them in LM German puzzle portal also. Maybe Uwe will manage to conduct another monthly sudoku contest for LMI in the forthcoming months. I think it will be a great.

Regards,

Zafer

Edited by zhergan 2010-11-10 2:04 PM

@ 2010-11-11 11:37 PM (#2462 - in reply to #2376) (#2462) Top

davmillar

Posts: 44

Country : United States

davmillar posted @ 2010-11-11 11:37 PM

Munira (and everyone else with small screens): I think I've found a fix and have tested it out on my local copy of the authors page. Deb will be adding the fix to the test pages sometime soon, which should work for almost everyone. Sorry about the inconvenience!

@ 2010-11-12 1:38 PM (#2463 - in reply to #2376) (#2463) Top

Administrator

Country : India

Administrator posted @ 2010-11-12 1:38 PM

Puzzle booklet (1 Title page + 10 pages of sudokus) is uploaded at the submission page. Here is the direct link

@ 2010-11-12 11:39 PM (#2469 - in reply to #2462) (#2469) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2010-11-12 11:39 PM

davmillar - 2010-11-11 11:37 PM

Munira (and everyone else with small screens): I think I've found a fix and have tested it out on my local copy of the authors page. Deb will be adding the fix to the test pages sometime soon, which should work for almost everyone. Sorry about the inconvenience!

Players with small screens - Please scroll towards right if you can't see the IB / PB.
David - thanks for helping in fixing this issue. We'll apply this technique in the next test.

@ 2010-11-13 3:20 AM (#2470 - in reply to #2376) (#2470) Top

zhergan

Posts: 32

Country : Turkey

zhergan posted @ 2010-11-13 3:20 AM

Hi to all,

The test starts within almost 2 hours. I wish all participants
the very best of luck. I hope you enjoy solving the sudokus.

Regards,

Zafer

@ 2010-11-13 5:01 PM (#2471 - in reply to #2470) (#2471) Top

rakesh_rai

Posts: 774

Country : India

rakesh_rai posted @ 2010-11-13 5:01 PM

Nice sudokus. I liked the Renban concept applied to solving the sudokus.


	@ 2010-11-03 3:51 PM (#2391 - in reply to #2390) (#2391) Top
purifire Posts: 460 Country : India	purifire posted @ 2010-11-03 3:51 PM purifire - 2010-11-03 3:30 PM Thanks Zafer... The explanation is indeed helpful :) Looking forward to the test.. Rishi solved the example on LM Germany and it was really a great puzzle.. :) Rishi
	@ 2010-11-03 3:52 PM (#2392 - in reply to #2389) (#2392) Top
zhergan Posts: 32 Country : Turkey	zhergan posted @ 2010-11-03 3:52 PM Minfang Lin - 2010-11-03 3:11 PM Chinese version is available on http://www.sudokufans.org.cn/forums/index.php?showtopic=125 if you want to play examples online, click the image of puzzle on the left. ( please use IE7/8 or Chrome) for Chinese translation. It is also very good that the examples may be played online I tried also playing in Firefox and I can say there was no problem also in Firefox Regards, Zafer
	@ 2010-11-03 4:50 PM (#2393 - in reply to #2391) (#2393) Top
zhergan Posts: 32 Country : Turkey	zhergan posted @ 2010-11-03 4:50 PM purifire - 2010-11-03 3:51 PM solved the example on LM Germany and it was really a great puzzle.. :) Rishi Hi Rishi, for your kind words I'm glad you liked it. I wish you will also enjoy the actual puzzle during the test. Zafer
	@ 2010-11-03 8:36 PM (#2394 - in reply to #2376) (#2394) Top
vopani Posts: 739 Country : India	vopani posted @ 2010-11-03 8:36 PM In the note for Shifted Sudoku, it says 'The numbers 1~6 must not occur in standard 2x3 boxes'. 'Must not occur' or 'May not occur'?
	@ 2010-11-03 9:26 PM (#2397 - in reply to #2394) (#2397) Top
zhergan Posts: 32 Country : Turkey	zhergan posted @ 2010-11-03 9:26 PM Hi Rohan, It is actually stated that "In the example numbers 1~6 is occured once inside standard 2x3 blocks. But it is not a MUST. Therefore there may be some duplicating digits inside these 2x3 standard blocks for 6x6 shifted sudoku (and 3x3 standard blocks for 9x9 shifted sudoku)". In order to clearify this note I'll try to prepare a 6x6 shifted sudoku with renban groups in which there exist duplicating digits inside 2x3 standard blocks and try to share it here soon. Regards, Zafer
	@ 2010-11-04 2:00 AM (#2399 - in reply to #2397) (#2399) Top
zhergan Posts: 32 Country : Turkey	zhergan posted @ 2010-11-04 2:00 AM Here comes my new 6x6 shifted sudoku design. Regards, Zafer (shiftedsudwithrbgex2.JPG) Attachments ---------------- shiftedsudwithrbgex2.JPG (18KB - 8 downloads)
	@ 2010-11-04 8:25 AM (#2400 - in reply to #2394) (#2400) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2010-11-04 8:25 AM Rohan Rao - 2010-11-03 8:36 PM In the note for Shifted Sudoku, it says 'The numbers 1~6 must not occur in standard 2x3 boxes'. 'Must not occur' or 'May not occur'? Rohan, it is "May not occur". It is basically a Toroidal Sudoku with special shapes of 2X3 or 3X3 blocks. [ So it should be much easier than a toroidal sudoku ] Zafer, thanks for uploading another example.
	@ 2010-11-04 11:12 AM (#2401 - in reply to #2400) (#2401) Top
vopani Posts: 739 Country : India	vopani posted @ 2010-11-04 11:12 AM Ok. Got it. Thanx Zafer and Deb. Looking forward to this test :-)
	@ 2010-11-04 1:09 PM (#2402 - in reply to #2399) (#2402) Top
zhergan Posts: 32 Country : Turkey	zhergan posted @ 2010-11-04 1:09 PM Hi to all. Here comes the answer of my second 6x6 shifted sudoku example. You can see the duplicating digit or digits inside the standard 2x3 blocks. Spoiler: show Thanks Deb for your help on spoiler usage. Regards, Zafer Edited by zhergan 2010-11-04 1:15 PM
	@ 2010-11-09 2:11 AM (#2432 - in reply to #2402) (#2432) Top
gramar Posts: 9 Country : United Kingdom	gramar posted @ 2010-11-09 2:11 AM I'm looking forward to this one and have managed to complete all the 6 x 6s in the instruction booklet apart from one - the Symmetric Unequal Sudoku. I expect I'm missing something really obvious but I can't work out which cells are 180 degrees symmetric to each other. Can anyone try and explain it to me please? Thanks.
	@ 2010-11-09 2:36 AM (#2434 - in reply to #2432) (#2434) Top
zhergan Posts: 32 Country : Turkey	zhergan posted @ 2010-11-09 2:36 AM Hi, In the symmetric unequal sudoku cells that are 180° symmetric to each other cannot have same digits. Keeping in mind that R corresponds to row and C corresponds to column; If we talk about 6x6 R[n]C[k] can never have the same digit as R[7-n]C[7-k] all n, k from 1 to 6 and if we consider 9x9 this time R[n]C[k] can never have the same digit as R[10-n]C[10-k] for all n, k from 1 to 9 (of course not both 5 same time). Try to apply this rule once. You'll see it works. Hope it is more clear now. Regards, Zafer
	@ 2010-11-09 2:41 AM (#2435 - in reply to #2434) (#2435) Top
zhergan Posts: 32 Country : Turkey	zhergan posted @ 2010-11-09 2:41 AM And who are interested about symmetric unequal sudoku may try to solve my 9x9 example on LM Germany site with the following address: http://www.logic-masters.de/Raetselportal/Raetsel/zeigen.php?id=000... It is not a hard one also. You may try it as an exercise. Zafer
	@ 2010-11-09 3:38 AM (#2436 - in reply to #2435) (#2436) Top
gramar Posts: 9 Country : United Kingdom	gramar posted @ 2010-11-09 3:38 AM Yes - I've got it now! Thanks for taking the time to reply - I've never come across this sudoku variant before. It's always great to come across a new puzzle type so I will go and try out the 9 x 9 now! Regards. Christine
	@ 2010-11-09 8:47 AM (#2437 - in reply to #2435) (#2437) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2010-11-09 8:47 AM Some more Symmetric Unequal Sudokus from our older tests (without renban constraints) From Classic Look Alikes Click here to solve online From Classic Look Alikes Click here to solve online from Mock 12 Click here to solve online from Mock 12 Click here to solve online
	@ 2010-11-09 1:11 PM (#2443 - in reply to #2377) (#2443) Top
lmunira Posts: 8 Country : India	lmunira posted @ 2010-11-09 1:11 PM Hi, I cannot see any link to the IB for the test. Is there something that I am missing? Munira.
	@ 2010-11-09 1:17 PM (#2445 - in reply to #2443) (#2445) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2010-11-09 1:17 PM lmunira - 2010-11-09 1:11 PM Hi, I cannot see any link to the IB for the test. Is there something that I am missing? Munira. If you are using a small screen computer, please scroll towards your right. We are having this problem for a while now. High time we get it fixed :-)
	@ 2010-11-09 1:37 PM (#2446 - in reply to #2445) (#2446) Top
lmunira Posts: 8 Country : India	lmunira posted @ 2010-11-09 1:37 PM Thanks, Have got it. Silly of me. Munira.
	@ 2010-11-10 1:51 AM (#2451 - in reply to #2376) (#2451) Top
Pyrrhon Country : Germany	Pyrrhon posted @ 2010-11-10 1:51 AM Renban is a puzzle type invented (so far as I know) by Inaba Naoki. You can find his examples at http://inabapuzzle.com/honkaku/renban.html . (All digits occur in each row and column, all cages are renban groups.) The oldest sudoku variant with renban groups is Hanidoku ( http://www.hanidoku.com/ ). Other renban at http://www.sachsentext.de/en/node/1156 and other hanidoku at http://www.sachsentext.de/en/taxonomy/term/162 . Pyrrhon
	@ 2010-11-10 11:55 AM (#2452 - in reply to #2451) (#2452) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2010-11-10 11:55 AM Pyrrhon - 2010-11-10 1:51 AM Renban is a puzzle type invented (so far as I know) by Inaba Naoki. You can find his examples at http://inabapuzzle.com/honkaku/renban.html . (All digits occur in each row and column, all cages are renban groups.) The oldest sudoku variant with renban groups is Hanidoku ( http://www.hanidoku.com/ ). Other renban at http://www.sachsentext.de/en/node/1156 and other hanidoku at http://www.sachsentext.de/en/taxonomy/term/162 . Pyrrhon Thank you for sharing history of Renban. I'm sure this will be informative to many players. Also, for those who don't know, Pyrrhon's website http://www.sachsentext.de contains list of many many Sudoku variants. You google for any Sudoku variant, and sachsentext.de is most likely to be in 1st page. Thanks Uwe for maintaining such a wonderful website.
	@ 2010-11-10 2:00 PM (#2453 - in reply to #2452) (#2453) Top
zhergan Posts: 32 Country : Turkey	zhergan posted @ 2010-11-10 2:00 PM debmohanty - 2010-11-10 11:55 AM Thank you for sharing history of Renban. I'm sure this will be informative to many players. Also, for those who don't know, Pyrrhon's website http://www.sachsentext.de contains list of many many Sudoku variants. You google for any Sudoku variant, and sachsentext.de is most likely to be in 1st page. Thanks Uwe for maintaining such a wonderful website. I also want to thank Uwe (aka Pyrrhon) for sharing information about Renban. Some puzzlers may not be familiar with this subject. I also follow his great site http://www.sachsentext.de and learn about different variants Uwe deals not only with sudokus and the site has a lot of different puzzle types also. But I know that solving Uwe's designs is always enjoyable. He shared some of them in LM German puzzle portal also. Maybe Uwe will manage to conduct another monthly sudoku contest for LMI in the forthcoming months. I think it will be a great. Regards, Zafer Edited by zhergan 2010-11-10 2:04 PM
	@ 2010-11-11 11:37 PM (#2462 - in reply to #2376) (#2462) Top
davmillar Posts: 44 Country : United States	davmillar posted @ 2010-11-11 11:37 PM Munira (and everyone else with small screens): I think I've found a fix and have tested it out on my local copy of the authors page. Deb will be adding the fix to the test pages sometime soon, which should work for almost everyone. Sorry about the inconvenience!
	@ 2010-11-12 1:38 PM (#2463 - in reply to #2376) (#2463) Top
Administrator Country : India	Administrator posted @ 2010-11-12 1:38 PM Puzzle booklet (1 Title page + 10 pages of sudokus) is uploaded at the submission page. Here is the direct link
	@ 2010-11-12 11:39 PM (#2469 - in reply to #2462) (#2469) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2010-11-12 11:39 PM davmillar - 2010-11-11 11:37 PM Munira (and everyone else with small screens): I think I've found a fix and have tested it out on my local copy of the authors page. Deb will be adding the fix to the test pages sometime soon, which should work for almost everyone. Sorry about the inconvenience! Players with small screens - Please scroll towards right if you can't see the IB / PB. David - thanks for helping in fixing this issue. We'll apply this technique in the next test.
	@ 2010-11-13 3:20 AM (#2470 - in reply to #2376) (#2470) Top
zhergan Posts: 32 Country : Turkey	zhergan posted @ 2010-11-13 3:20 AM Hi to all, The test starts within almost 2 hours. I wish all participants the very best of luck. I hope you enjoy solving the sudokus. Regards, Zafer
	@ 2010-11-13 5:01 PM (#2471 - in reply to #2470) (#2471) Top
rakesh_rai Posts: 774 Country : India	rakesh_rai posted @ 2010-11-13 5:01 PM Nice sudokus. I liked the Renban concept applied to solving the sudokus.