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ISKL Round 3 (15th - 18th Nov) Score Discuss

V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013
   LMI Tests -> Monthly Sudoku and Puzzle Tests80 posts • Page 1 of 4 • 1 2 3 4
Administrator
Subject: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-09 8:03 PM (#10230) (#10230) Top


200050010010020
Location: India


Administrator
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-14 12:38 PM (#10324 - in reply to #10230) (#10324) Top


200050010010020
Location: India

Logic Masters India announces March Sudoku Test — V2V

Dates : 23rd — 25th March

Instruction Booklet & Submission : here

Author : Richard Stolk

Richard
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-14 10:04 PM (#10327 - in reply to #10324) (#10327) Top


WCPN Author

Posts: 191
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Location: Netherlands
Just like for my previous test Copy Paste, I have gathered a few links to more practise material. The following puzzles appeared either in the puzzle portal of Logic Masters Germany or in a German Sudoku Championship.
If you have any question about one of these puzzles or regarding ‘V2V’, please do not hesitate to ask; I’ll be happy to answer.
Greater than Consecutive: Hard Hard
Clone: Medium
Primes: Easy (Different notation of the primes!)
Thermometers: Medium
Rank: Medium
Even Sandwich: Medium
Sum Sandwich: Hard
1~9: Medium
Frame 1~9: Hard

1~9:
WPF Grand Prix German round (Instruction booklet) puzzle 9
WPF Grand Prix German round (Contest) puzzle 9 Password: MzrM65W1fdE2NKiR
Sudoku Cup 4: Link

Even Sandwich, Rank and Clone were inspired by:
LMI sudoku test Classics vs Innovatives

GT Consecutive was inspired by:
LMI sudoku test Sudoku 8x8

For Thermometers there are many examples available, I think.

I have planned to publish a few more practice puzzles on the website of LM Germany before the test.
I will keep you all informed after I have done so.

Have fun!
SKnight
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-15 7:57 PM (#10330 - in reply to #10230) (#10330) Top




Posts: 25
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Location: USA
A question about rules:
For the hot/cold thermometers, does the choice of hot or cold have to be consistent within a given thermometer?
This didn't happen in the practice puzzle, but in principle would "1234(5)6789" have been a valid thermometer for that puzzle?
Richard
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-15 8:10 PM (#10331 - in reply to #10330) (#10331) Top


WCPN Author

Posts: 191
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Location: Netherlands
SKnight - 2013-03-15 7:57 PM

A question about rules:
For the hot/cold thermometers, does the choice of hot or cold have to be consistent within a given thermometer?
This didn't happen in the practice puzzle, but in principle would "1234(5)6789" have been a valid thermometer for that puzzle?

Yes, the choice of increasing/decreasing has to be consistent within a given thermometer.
The example of 1234(5)6789 is not a valid thermometer.
Richard
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-16 11:28 AM (#10335 - in reply to #10324) (#10335) Top


WCPN Author

Posts: 191
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Location: Netherlands
I have added two more practise puzzles on my user page at Logic Masters Germany:

Shaken Clones and Hot/Cold Thermometers

The rules for Hot/Cold Thermometers raised questions, here as well as in the puzzle portal, so I have added a sentence to clearify things. A new IB will be uploaded, meanwhile the full instructions for Hot/Cold Thermometers are written here:

From the bulb to both ends the digits in each thermometer-shaped region should be either in increasing or decreasing order. This increasing or decreasing order has to be the same in both directions.
euklid
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-16 5:54 PM (#10336 - in reply to #10230) (#10336) Top




Posts: 27
20
Location: Austria
Two rules question:

*) Clones: The rules say: "Cloned shapes may be rotated (not reflected!)." What happens in the case that a clone shape is a 1xn rectangle?
Let us assume that two corresponding clone shapes are I-shaped pentominos. For simplicity, both shall be horizontal. Is it allowed that one shapes contains the numbers 12345 and the other contains 54321.
By the rules this is allowed (may be rotated) and forbidden (not reflected). Please clarify (or tell us, that such shapes will not occur). :-)

*) Sum Sandwich: Here the rules seem perfectly clear to me but I would appreciate a confirmation...
Let us assume that two numbers are given outside the same row/column of the puzzle, say 3 6. Then 3 must be sandwiched by 1 and 2 and 6 must be sandwiched by 1/5 or 2/4. Those sandwiches may overlap, i.e. 23165 is valid.
The sequence 1 3 6 8 is not valid for this example (with the wrong thinking that the numbers 1 and 8 equal 9 and sandwich the numbers 3 and 6 equaling 9 also).

Richard
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-16 6:20 PM (#10337 - in reply to #10336) (#10337) Top


WCPN Author

Posts: 191
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Location: Netherlands
euklid - 2013-03-16 5:54 PM

Two rules question:

*) Clones: The rules say: "Cloned shapes may be rotated (not reflected!)." What happens in the case that a clone shape is a 1xn rectangle?
Let us assume that two corresponding clone shapes are I-shaped pentominos. For simplicity, both shall be horizontal. Is it allowed that one shapes contains the numbers 12345 and the other contains 54321.
By the rules this is allowed (may be rotated) and forbidden (not reflected). Please clarify (or tell us, that such shapes will not occur). :-)

*) Sum Sandwich: Here the rules seem perfectly clear to me but I would appreciate a confirmation...
Let us assume that two numbers are given outside the same row/column of the puzzle, say 3 6. Then 3 must be sandwiched by 1 and 2 and 6 must be sandwiched by 1/5 or 2/4. Those sandwiches may overlap, i.e. 23165 is valid.
The sequence 1 3 6 8 is not valid for this example (with the wrong thinking that the numbers 1 and 8 equal 9 and sandwich the numbers 3 and 6 equaling 9 also).


CLONES: If a clone shape is a 1xn-rectangle, reflection gives the same result as rotation, so in this case reflection is also allowed. In the practise puzzle (link also in my thread above) 1x2 and 1x3-shapes occur.

SUM SANDWICH: 23165 is a valid, partly overlapping solution for 3 and 6 both being sandwiched in the same row/column. I have written this example puzzle (link also in my thread above) on purpose with a long chain of overlapping sums in column 2.
Richard
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-17 4:42 PM (#10342 - in reply to #10337) (#10342) Top


WCPN Author

Posts: 191
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New practise puzzle added in the portal of LM Germany:
Perfect Squares. Enjoy!

Last practise puzzle will be published coming friday at noon (22 March).
Fred76
Subject: RE: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-17 6:43 PM (#10343 - in reply to #10230) (#10343) Top



Diagonal Vision Author

Posts: 335
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In the SHAKEN CLONES, the rule is "Each shape is cloned one or more times."
Are all same shapes clones to each others or is it allowed to have 2 different pairs of clones for 4 same shapes, for example?

I look forward to this test. Some interesting new variations here !

Fred
Administrator
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-17 6:49 PM (#10344 - in reply to #10331) (#10344) Top


200050010010020
Location: India
Richard - 2013-03-15 8:10 PM
Yes, the choice of increasing/decreasing has to be consistent within a given thermometer.
The example of 1234(5)6789 is not a valid thermometer.
IB has this clarification now.
Richard
Subject: RE: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-17 7:18 PM (#10346 - in reply to #10343) (#10346) Top


WCPN Author

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Location: Netherlands
Fred76 - 2013-03-17 6:43 PM

... is it allowed to have 2 different pairs of clones for 4 same shapes, for example?



Hi Fred,

No, this is not allowed.
Administrator
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-20 6:23 PM (#10359 - in reply to #10230) (#10359) Top


200050010010020
Location: India
Selected examples can be solved online now.
Richard
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-22 4:38 PM (#10370 - in reply to #10342) (#10370) Top


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Richard - 2013-03-17 4:42 PM
Last practise puzzle will be published coming friday at noon (22 March).


As promised I have uploaded the last practise puzzle in the puzzle portal of LM Germany:

Rank Killer

With this last one I hope all participants can have a decent preparation to the test.

Good luck to all, and more important: Have fun!
Administrator
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-23 3:53 AM (#10373 - in reply to #10230) (#10373) Top


200050010010020
Location: India

Announcements

1) Password protected Sudoku booklet is uploaded. It has 7 pages. There is no cover page.
2) Paper only link : http://logicmastersindia.com/2013/03S/?paper=1 Use this link if you are not planning to use online solving at all. (Paper Only link will keep your browser less cluttered and less loaded)
3) Link to score page : http://logicmastersindia.com/2013/03S/score.asp
4) This thread will be made restricted so that players can freely discuss about the competition.

An LMI player
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-23 7:52 AM (#10375 - in reply to #10230) (#10375) Top


An LMI Player with Sudoku ratings 500-
 How balanced do you think the puzzle types of this test were? Fairly balanced
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Just right
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Fairly Nice
 How did you feel about the length / time limit for this test? A bit too many puzzles
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did their point values reflect the difficulty/time spent? Many puzzles were worth too much or too little
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


TiiT
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-23 3:45 PM (#10379 - in reply to #10230) (#10379) Top




Posts: 111
100
Location: Estonia
 How balanced do you think the puzzle types of this test were? Fairly balanced
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Just right
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Fairly Nice
 How did you feel about the length / time limit for this test? Just right
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did their point values reflect the difficulty/time spent? Many puzzles were worth too much or too little
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


DavidCollison
Subject: RE: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-23 7:49 PM (#10380 - in reply to #10230) (#10380) Top




Posts: 5

Location: United Kingdom
Thanks for an interesting set of puzzles.

I will be interested to see the answer for Rank Killer as I think I must have misunderstood the rules. I got stuck three times in the bottom left corner (a delay which later meant that I missed out on typing the answer for Holt/Cold Thermometer by about five seconds ). In case there is a problem with Rank Killer, I'll explain my logic.

r9c1 was the 5 of 1/2/3/5. The vertical 1/2/3 meant r5c2 had to be 4 rather than 3 with r7c1 as 8 to be third and r5c1/r6c1 as 6/9. r9c6 had to be 4 because r9c1 was already 5, which also gave 7/8/9 from r9c7 onwards. On r9, that left 1/2/3/6 to place. r9c4 had to be at least 3 to be third but could not be 6 because 6 plus a higher number in r7c4 would be too much for a four-cage total of 14. So, r9c4 is 3. That makes r8c4 and r9c5 1/2. 1+2+3+8=14 making r7c4 8 which clashes with r7c1.

Hope that made sense. Thanks again, David.
Richard
Subject: RE: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-23 7:53 PM (#10381 - in reply to #10380) (#10381) Top


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Hi David,

Sorry to read that you had a lot of problems with the rank killer.

I have planned to write some lines about each puzzle as soon as the test is over, with at least the first important steps in the solving process. I hope that will help.
DavidCollison
Subject: RE: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-23 8:29 PM (#10382 - in reply to #10381) (#10382) Top




Posts: 5

Location: United Kingdom
Thanks Richard. I enjoyed the puzzles - thank you for all the work you have put into creating them. David.
prasanna16391
Subject: RE: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-23 9:53 PM (#10383 - in reply to #10380) (#10383) Top


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DavidCollison - 2013-03-23 7:49 PM

r9c1 was the 5 of 1/2/3/5. The vertical 1/2/3 meant r5c2 had to be 4 rather than 3



I think you'll find you eliminated another possibility here itself, for R5C2 :)
DavidCollison
Subject: RE: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-23 9:59 PM (#10386 - in reply to #10383) (#10386) Top




Posts: 5

Location: United Kingdom
prasanna16391 - 2013-03-23 9:53 PM

DavidCollison - 2013-03-23 7:49 PM

r9c1 was the 5 of 1/2/3/5. The vertical 1/2/3 meant r5c2 had to be 4 rather than 3



I think you'll find you eliminated another possibility here itself, for R5C2 :)


Oh, now I see - thank you !
wicktroll
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-23 10:45 PM (#10387 - in reply to #10230) (#10387) Top




Posts: 16

Location: Hungary
 How balanced do you think the puzzle types of this test were? Fairly balanced
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Just right
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Fairly Nice
 How did you feel about the length / time limit for this test? Just right
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did their point values reflect the difficulty/time spent? Most puzzles were worth the right amount
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


forcolin
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-23 10:57 PM (#10388 - in reply to #10230) (#10388) Top





Posts: 156
1002020
Location: Italy
 How balanced do you think the puzzle types of this test were? Fairly balanced
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Just right
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Very nice
 How did you feel about the length / time limit for this test? Just right
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did their point values reflect the difficulty/time spent? Most puzzles were worth the right amount
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


Para
Subject: Re: V2V — March Sudoku Test — 23rd-25th March 2013 @ 2013-03-24 5:05 AM (#10389 - in reply to #10230) (#10389) Top




Posts: 311
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Location: The Netherlands
Can I get a Mulligan? Really nice puzzles, except my brain wasn't in the mood. Broke both the Clones and Greather than X 3 times. Knew my submission for the second one would be wrong, but had no time left, so thought. you never know.
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