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Evergreens - 31st Oct - 2nd Nov - Puzzle Ramayan & IPC Qualifier56 posts • Page 1 of 3 • 1 2 3
@ 2015-10-26 3:14 PM (#19690) (#19690) Top

Administrator



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Administrator posted @ 2015-10-26 3:14 PM





Link for rules and other details about Puzzle Ramayan : http://logicmastersindia.com/PR/2015-16PR.asp
Instructions for Evergreens - http://logicmastersindia.com/PR/201510/

@ 2015-10-27 2:21 AM (#19696 - in reply to #19690) (#19696) Top

auroux



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auroux posted @ 2015-10-27 2:21 AM

I think the answer key for the sample Anglers puzzle is not quite correct (the last column should be 2).Similarly for multi-anglers, the first column should be 4.

Edited by auroux 2015-10-27 2:25 AM
@ 2015-10-27 7:01 AM (#19700 - in reply to #19696) (#19700) Top

Administrator



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Country : India

Administrator posted @ 2015-10-27 7:01 AM

Fixed the answer keys for Anglers and Multi-Anglers
@ 2015-10-27 9:33 PM (#19706 - in reply to #19690) (#19706) Top

tamz29



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tamz29 posted @ 2015-10-27 9:33 PM

Is it required that all cells be used in Anglers?
Also, I think if that many rows/columns are marked, the answer keys of Anglers/Multi-Anglers is horrible.
Maybe mark about 4-6 cells and describe the orientation?
Or label each fish with a letter and ask which fish the cell lead to?
@ 2015-10-27 11:54 PM (#19707 - in reply to #19706) (#19707) Top

kishy72



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kishy72 posted @ 2015-10-27 11:54 PM

In Hashi,if un-numbered islands are present,do they need to be connected by bridges as well ? In other words ,do every given circle need to be connected by bridges regardless of whether it is filled with number or not ?I saw a puzzle where even un-numbered islands had to be used to make the system connected....

@ 2015-10-28 11:49 AM (#19708 - in reply to #19706) (#19708) Top

vopani



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vopani posted @ 2015-10-28 11:49 AM

Is it required that all cells be used in Anglers?

The example has an unused cell, so I'm sure the answer is 'No'.

Also, I think if that many rows/columns are marked, the answer keys of Anglers/Multi-Anglers is horrible.
Maybe mark about 4-6 cells and describe the orientation?
Or label each fish with a letter and ask which fish the cell lead to?

I don't fully agree with you. We might have personal preferences which differ.

If 'many' rows are marked, I think most answer keys will be cumbersome. But, I still think 'number of turns' is better and faster than 'length of longest segment' or 'orientation in cells'.
Labelling a fish with a letter and asking which fish the outside clues lead to is a good idea, but won't work because many times you know the fish they connect, but the challenge is in drawing the paths.

Answer keys are not going to change, so I hope not many rows/columns are marked :-)
@ 2015-10-28 3:07 PM (#19709 - in reply to #19690) (#19709) Top

rob



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rob posted @ 2015-10-28 3:07 PM

For Anglers, we asked for a couple of rows in the German qualification, with I=straight, L=turn, F=fish and -=blank (maybe X would be nicer there). That worked out quite well. Not that I'm suggesting you change the code now, just for future consideration.
@ 2015-10-29 1:23 PM (#19718 - in reply to #19707) (#19718) Top

debmohanty




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debmohanty posted @ 2015-10-29 1:23 PM

kishy72 - 2015-10-27 11:54 PM

In Hashi,if un-numbered islands are present,do they need to be connected by bridges as well ? In other words ,do every given circle need to be connected by bridges regardless of whether it is filled with number or not ?I saw a puzzle where even un-numbered islands had to be used to make the system connected....


All islands will be numbered in the test.
@ 2015-10-30 12:06 PM (#19722 - in reply to #19708) (#19722) Top

amitsowani




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amitsowani posted @ 2015-10-30 12:06 PM

Rohan Rao - 2015-10-28 11:49 AM

Is it required that all cells be used in Anglers?

The example has an unused cell, so I'm sure the answer is 'No'.



Rohan is partially right as angler puzzles can be created without using all grid cells like in the IB.

You can always quickly check the sum of the anglers to check if all cells will be used or not :)

However to avoid unnecessary computation let me announce that all the angler puzzles in the test (including multi-anglers) WILL USE ALL CELLS IN THE GRID.





@ 2015-10-30 7:21 PM (#19724 - in reply to #19690) (#19724) Top

Administrator



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Administrator posted @ 2015-10-30 7:21 PM

Points Table

Instruction Booklet is re-uploaded with points table. Here it is for your quick reference.



@ 2015-10-30 7:27 PM (#19725 - in reply to #19690) (#19725) Top

Administrator



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Country : India

Administrator posted @ 2015-10-30 7:27 PM

Structure of the puzzle booklet

We found that the cell sizes are little small in the IB, so we have increased them a bit in the puzzle booklet.

The puzzle booklet will have 8 pages
Page 1 - Hashi 1,2,3,4
Page 2 - Magnets 1,2
Page 3 - Magnets 3,4
Page 4 - Arrows 1,2,3,4
Page 5 - Anglers 1,2,3,4
Page 6 - Multi-Anglers
Page 7 - Dominos 1,2,3
Page 8 - Dominos 4, Missing Dominos

As usual, there will not be a cover page in the puzzle booklet.

@ 2015-10-31 12:37 AM (#19726 - in reply to #19690) (#19726) Top

vopani



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vopani posted @ 2015-10-31 12:37 AM

 How well did the variants represent the theme of the test ? variations represented the theme well
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Too many hard puzzles
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Very nice
 Which set of puzzles did you like the most? Dominos
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did the point values reflect the difficulty? Many puzzles were worth too much or too little
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


Puzzles were really nice. Enjoyed solving most of them.

I felt the set is quite hard for PR. And the way our scoring system is set up, I won't be surprised if most players' worst performance discarded is this round.

I felt the Hashi puzzles were under-valued and the Dominos were over-valued, but might be a personal opinion.

Maybe we need to rethink on the scoring system, which is based on the assumption that all tests are 'similar' in difficulty, whereas this one is way off.

Really liked the solving paths of Hashi.
@ 2015-10-31 3:05 AM (#19727 - in reply to #19690) (#19727) Top

Rubben



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Rubben posted @ 2015-10-31 3:05 AM

 How well did the variants represent the theme of the test ? variations represented the theme well
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Just right
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Very nice
 Which set of puzzles did you like the most? Anglers
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did the point values reflect the difficulty? Most puzzles were worth the right amount
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


@ 2015-10-31 2:47 PM (#19729 - in reply to #19690) (#19729) Top

An LMI player



An LMI player posted @ 2015-10-31 2:47 PM

 How well did the variants represent the theme of the test ? variations represented the theme well
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Too many medium difficult puzzles
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Fairly Nice
 Which set of puzzles did you like the most? Arrows
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did the point values reflect the difficulty? Most puzzles were worth the right amount
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


@ 2015-10-31 9:28 PM (#19730 - in reply to #19690) (#19730) Top

kishy72



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kishy72 posted @ 2015-10-31 9:28 PM

 How well did the variants represent the theme of the test ? variations represented the theme well
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Too many hard puzzles
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Fairly Nice
 Which set of puzzles did you like the most? Dominos
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did the point values reflect the difficulty? Most puzzles were worth too much or too little
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


Found this set really hard.I practised Hashi well before the test but found them too difficult and didn't gain much of an advantage on them.I completed all Hashis at close to 35 mins.Arrows too managed to stall me for quite some time.I found some comfort in dominoes where I managed to gain some quick points and which I never practised before the test....A very hard set .Would have preferred more easier puzzles.....
@ 2015-10-31 10:27 PM (#19731 - in reply to #19690) (#19731) Top

ghirsch



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ghirsch posted @ 2015-10-31 10:27 PM

 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Too many hard puzzles
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Fairly Nice
 Which set of puzzles did you like the most? Anglers
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did the point values reflect the difficulty? Many puzzles were worth too much or too little
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


This round felt far more difficult than previous ones. I did enjoy the puzzles that I solved though, and I thought the multi-anglers was very fun.

Can someone explain the theme to me though? What does "evergreen" mean?
@ 2015-10-31 11:10 PM (#19732 - in reply to #19731) (#19732) Top

vopani



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vopani posted @ 2015-10-31 11:10 PM

ghirsch - 2015-10-31 10:27 PM

Can someone explain the theme to me though? What does "evergreen" mean?

They are just Classic puzzles that have been appearing in contests for a long time. We couldn't have too many standard puzzles in one test, so we split it across two (Classics and Evergreens).

Also, a tribute to two really nice tests during the birth of LMI: Evergreens and Evergreens2 :-)
@ 2015-10-31 11:48 PM (#19733 - in reply to #19690) (#19733) Top

peluri



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peluri posted @ 2015-10-31 11:48 PM

 How well did the variants represent the theme of the test ? variations represented the theme well
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Just right
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Very nice
 Which set of puzzles did you like the most? Arrows
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did the point values reflect the difficulty? Most puzzles were worth the right amount
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


@ 2015-11-01 12:50 AM (#19734 - in reply to #19690) (#19734) Top

bob



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bob posted @ 2015-11-01 12:50 AM

 How well did the variants represent the theme of the test ? variations represented the theme well
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Too many hard puzzles
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Very nice
 Which set of puzzles did you like the most? Magnets
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did the point values reflect the difficulty? Many puzzles were worth too much or too little
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


Puzzles seemed unexpectedly hard this round. I used to subscribe to CrocoPuzzle and always did the magnet puzzles. I was quite stumped by the harder ones in this set. Even the Hashi puzzles seemed hard and I have quite a bit of experience with these. I barely had time to look at the easy domino puzzles and completely skipped an entire category (anglers). There is usually time to at least scan them.
@ 2015-11-01 7:00 AM (#19735 - in reply to #19690) (#19735) Top

swaroop2011




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swaroop2011 posted @ 2015-11-01 7:00 AM

Puzzles were nice but I believe they were tough. Lot of new tricks in lots of puzzles. I continued Solving even after the time was over and took around 25 min more to solve few more puzzles. Only left ones were Magents 9 pointer and Arrows 3rd one. Thanks to deb for pointing out the start for Arrows 3rd one.
Really lots and lots of new tricks to explore in this round. Performance wise I believe my bad run is continuing after my below par performance in Numbers Round. Hopefully will improve in upcoming rounds.
Thanks Amit for Fantastic Puzzles.

Would appreciate if anyone can tell the path for Magnets last one. (I could place only 3 magnets in the entire grid after lot of struggle) ?
@ 2015-11-01 7:02 AM (#19736 - in reply to #19690) (#19736) Top

An LMI player



An LMI player posted @ 2015-11-01 7:02 AM

 How well did the variants represent the theme of the test ? variations represented the theme well
 What was your opinion of the distribution of easy/hard puzzles? Just right
 What did you think about the puzzle quality of the test? Average
 Which set of puzzles did you like the most? Magnets
 Of the puzzles you solved/attempted, how well did the point values reflect the difficulty? Many puzzles were worth too much or too little
 What was your opinion of the booklet formatting and printing? Just right


@ 2015-11-01 8:21 AM (#19737 - in reply to #19735) (#19737) Top

amitsowani




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amitsowani posted @ 2015-11-01 8:21 AM

swaroop2011 - 2015-11-01 7:00 AM

Would appreciate if anyone can tell the path for Magnets last one. (I could place only 3 magnets in the entire grid after lot of struggle) ?


The fourth magnets puzzle uses minmax constraints.
Look at columns 3,4 and 5.

A column with few signs filled (2,2) is surrounded by two heavily filled columns (4,4) and (4,3).
This should give you a start
@ 2015-11-01 10:07 AM (#19738 - in reply to #19737) (#19738) Top

swaroop2011




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swaroop2011 posted @ 2015-11-01 10:07 AM

amitsowani - 2015-11-01 8:21 AM

swaroop2011 - 2015-11-01 7:00 AM

Would appreciate if anyone can tell the path for Magnets last one. (I could place only 3 magnets in the entire grid after lot of struggle) ?


The fourth magnets puzzle uses minmax constraints.
Look at columns 3,4 and 5.

A column with few signs filled (2,2) is surrounded by two heavily filled columns (4,4) and (4,3).
This should give you a start


Thanks amit. But I guess you are explaining it for Magnets 8 pointer (3rd puzzle). That I already got. I am asking for last one (4th Puzzle - 9 pointer) ?
@ 2015-11-01 11:25 AM (#19739 - in reply to #19690) (#19739) Top

ghirsch



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ghirsch posted @ 2015-11-01 11:25 AM

Regarding the booklet formatting, I somewhat prefer the bank in domino puzzles to be formatted as below (or flipped) rather than the way they were in this test. The disadvantage is that it takes up more space, but for me it makes it much easier to think about which dominoes I have already found and which I have left. I don't know what other people's opinions about this are though, so maybe this is just me.

Image and video hosting by TinyPic

Edited by ghirsch 2015-11-01 11:29 AM
@ 2015-11-01 2:37 PM (#19740 - in reply to #19738) (#19740) Top

amitsowani




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amitsowani posted @ 2015-11-01 2:37 PM

swaroop2011 - 2015-11-01 10:07 AM

amitsowani - 2015-11-01 8:21 AM

swaroop2011 - 2015-11-01 7:00 AM

Would appreciate if anyone can tell the path for Magnets last one. (I could place only 3 magnets in the entire grid after lot of struggle) ?


The fourth magnets puzzle uses minmax constraints.
Look at columns 3,4 and 5.

A column with few signs filled (2,2) is surrounded by two heavily filled columns (4,4) and (4,3).
This should give you a start


Thanks amit. But I guess you are explaining it for Magnets 8 pointer (3rd puzzle). That I already got. I am asking for last one (4th Puzzle - 9 pointer) ?



The fourth one is based on transfer of polarities across rows (transfer = number of unbalanced vertical magnets across the two rows).
Look at the number of vertical magnets required across rows 4 and 5, 5 and 6. Also look at columns 6 and 7.
Evergreens - 31st Oct - 2nd Nov - Puzzle Ramayan & IPC Qualifier56 posts • Page 1 of 3 • 1 2 3
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