Thread - Twist - LMI April'11 Puzzle Test on 9th/10th

@ 2011-04-05 3:40 AM (#3927 - in reply to #3910) (#3927) Top

Posts: 31

Country : United Kingdom

PuzzleScot posted @ 2011-04-05 3:40 AM

Hi,

Can you please confirm the times, with time zone, that this contest is available for competing?
Note that the UK is currently in British Summer Time (GMT+1)

Thanks
Alan

Edited by PuzzleScot 2011-04-05 3:41 AM

@ 2011-04-05 6:43 AM (#3928 - in reply to #3927) (#3928) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-05 6:43 AM

PuzzleScot - 2011-04-05 3:40 AM

Hi,

Can you please confirm the times, with time zone, that this contest is available for competing?
Note that the UK is currently in British Summer Time (GMT+1)

Thanks
Alan

Done. Please check the submission page.

@ 2011-04-05 12:32 PM (#3930 - in reply to #3910) (#3930) Top

harmeet

Posts: 87

Country : India

harmeet posted @ 2011-04-05 12:32 PM

"twist" IB seems to be very interesting. will miss the test this time owing to travel. will take it offline.

@ 2011-04-06 7:03 AM (#3932 - in reply to #3910) (#3932) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-06 7:03 AM

Note about Hitori Sum Answer key

This is only puzzle where answer is 'by column'. This is not easy to remember while entering the solution under time-limit.
So I decided to mark all the columns as shown below.

There is no change in rules or answer key definition.

@ 2011-04-06 2:46 PM (#3939 - in reply to #3910) (#3939) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-06 2:46 PM

Just to make sure that everyone understands the point reduction formula, here is an example.
Basically, 'how much you get for a particular puzzle' depends upon 'when you submitted it'. Nothing else.

@ 2011-04-08 9:52 AM (#3947 - in reply to #3910) (#3947) Top

kiwijam

Posts: 187

Country : New Zealand

kiwijam posted @ 2011-04-08 9:52 AM

In the answer for the Minesweeper puzzle, there is a mine next to the 4 (left end of second row) that has 3 mines around it. Is this allowed?

@ 2011-04-08 10:12 AM (#3949 - in reply to #3947) (#3949) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-08 10:12 AM

You are referring to R2C1. Yes, that is allowed.

The following situation is NOT allowed because of R2C3.

Cells with numbers will have exactly same number of mines around them.
Cells with mines may have any number of mines around them

Cells without numbers and mines can NOT have 3 mines around them. [This is the only rule change wrt a standard Minesweeper puzzle ]

@ 2011-04-08 10:17 AM (#3950 - in reply to #3910) (#3950) Top

kiwijam

Posts: 187

Country : New Zealand

kiwijam posted @ 2011-04-08 10:17 AM

Ah thank you. I thought it meant:
(Cells without numbers) and mines can NOT have 3 mines around them
instead of:
Cells without (numbers and mines) can NOT have 3 mines around them

Looking forward to trying these twists. The hitori sum is my favourite new idea, normally the numbers just get ignored.

@ 2011-04-08 10:24 AM (#3951 - in reply to #3950) (#3951) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-08 10:24 AM

During IB review itself, we found that the wording is little cryptic. So I included the example such that all the scenarios are reflected.

Hope it is clear to all.

@ 2011-04-08 9:44 PM (#3952 - in reply to #3950) (#3952) Top

brianklimek

Posts: 14

Country : United States

brianklimek posted @ 2011-04-08 9:44 PM

Ah, glad this was addressed, I just logged on to check on the same thing, and I had misinterpretted the instructions the same way. Thanks.
I look forward to this one. Thanks again to the organizers and creators!

@ 2011-04-08 10:29 PM (#3953 - in reply to #3910) (#3953) Top

Administrator

Country : India

Administrator posted @ 2011-04-08 10:29 PM

Puzzle Booklet uploaded. It has 12 pages, each page has 2 puzzles (and instructions and solution to the example) of one particular type.
There is no cover page.

@ 2011-04-09 5:33 AM (#3954 - in reply to #3910) (#3954) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 5:33 AM

Twist has started.
Good luck everyone!

@ 2011-04-09 10:45 AM (#3955 - in reply to #3954) (#3955) Top

motris

Posts: 199

Country : United States

motris posted @ 2011-04-09 10:45 AM

Wow! Phenomenal test with a nice balance of difficulties and many fun puzzles on both ends of the spectrum. The twists were very interesting, and you even managed to make Hitori fun! You don't know how much that means to me. Thanks a lot Deb.

@ 2011-04-09 10:50 AM (#3956 - in reply to #3910) (#3956) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 10:50 AM

The score page doesn't show the bonus properly. Will be uploading fixed score page in few minutes

@ 2011-04-09 11:00 AM (#3957 - in reply to #3956) (#3957) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 11:00 AM

debmohanty - 2011-04-09 10:50 AM

The score page doesn't show the bonus properly. Will be uploading fixed score page in few minutes

Bonus should show up properly now - here is the link to score page - http://logicmastersindia.com/M201104P/score.asp - which you can view after you complete the test.

A twisted view of the score page available here - http://logicmastersindia.com/M201104P/score.asp?view=twist

@ 2011-04-09 11:40 AM (#3958 - in reply to #3955) (#3958) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 11:40 AM

motris - 2011-04-09 10:45 AM

Wow! Phenomenal test with a nice balance of difficulties and many fun puzzles on both ends of the spectrum. The twists were very interesting, and you even managed to make Hitori fun! You don't know how much that means to me. Thanks a lot Deb.

Thanks a lot for the feedback.
Yes, Hitori is a type that is not liked by all. I'm glad that the 2 Hitoris came out well and you liked them.

@ 2011-04-09 1:24 PM (#3961 - in reply to #3910) (#3961) Top

Para

Posts: 315

Country : The Netherlands

Para posted @ 2011-04-09 1:24 PM

Thanks for the test. I had fun. My favourite was the ABC twist, really good puzzles both. And I managed to avoid making any entry errors, although I did take a very cautious approach entering my answer keys this time, probably cost me some time as I doublechecked what I had put in each time.

@ 2011-04-09 1:26 PM (#3962 - in reply to #3939) (#3962) Top

anurag

Posts: 136

Country : India

anurag posted @ 2011-04-09 1:26 PM

thats a nice clarification.before looking at this post,i was surprised about the reduction as i thought it was calculated on the total score.This logic i think should be posted on the contest page too,to ensure no one is in doubt.

@ 2011-04-09 1:38 PM (#3963 - in reply to #3962) (#3963) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 1:38 PM

anurag - 2011-04-09 1:26 PM

thats a nice clarification.before looking at this post,i was surprised about the reduction as i thought it was calculated on the total score.This logic i think should be posted on the contest page too,to ensure no one is in doubt.

We've experimented with many bonus systems, not all of them are flawless - but we'll never have a bonus system where players need calculators (more than pencil and eraser) before submitting a puzzle.

@ 2011-04-09 1:46 PM (#3964 - in reply to #3963) (#3964) Top

anurag

Posts: 136

Country : India

anurag posted @ 2011-04-09 1:46 PM

that sounded funny.i didnt say the contestants would start calculating.in fact i liked this penalty(bonus)system:) Good and simple one.
To make it better,why not increase the number of intervals and make it 6 ,of 5 mins each.That can probably sharpen the evaluation.

@ 2011-04-09 1:54 PM (#3965 - in reply to #3964) (#3965) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 1:54 PM

anurag - 2011-04-09 1:46 PM

that sounded funny.i didnt say the contestants would start calculating.in fact i liked this penalty(bonus)system:) Good and simple one.
To make it better,why not increase the number of intervals and make it 6 ,of 5 mins each.That can probably sharpen the evaluation.

Changing the interval to 5 minutes is an option. But it might become too stressful for players in last 30 minutes.
As the poll options indicate, we definitely can make adjustments to this system in future.

@ 2011-04-09 2:17 PM (#3966 - in reply to #3965) (#3966) Top

rakesh_rai

Posts: 774

Country : India

rakesh_rai posted @ 2011-04-09 2:17 PM

Nice twists. I liked L&M&I, Lights and Hitori Sum the most.

@ 2011-04-09 2:36 PM (#3967 - in reply to #3910) (#3967) Top

anurag

Posts: 136

Country : India

anurag posted @ 2011-04-09 2:36 PM

a question off the topic..I want to know if the preliminary online is all we need to give(as it used to be every year) ,or the regional rounds are required too?

@ 2011-04-09 5:25 PM (#3968 - in reply to #3910) (#3968) Top

anurag

Posts: 136

Country : India

anurag posted @ 2011-04-09 5:25 PM

Odd skyscraper: Some evens inside look like valid skyscrapers .The 2,4 in the third row can be valid and satsify the outside '3' at the same time.Is that a problem with the example? or will that hold for the test puzzle too?

Edited by anurag 2011-04-09 5:30 PM

@ 2011-04-09 6:10 PM (#3969 - in reply to #3968) (#3969) Top

debmohanty

Country : India

debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 6:10 PM

anurag - 2011-04-09 5:25 PM

Odd skyscraper: Some evens inside look like valid skyscrapers .The 2,4 in the third row can be valid and satsify the outside '3' at the same time.Is that a problem with the example? or will that hold for the test puzzle too?

I think the rule and the example match perfectly.

Feedback about "points reduction" scoring system
How do you feel about the new "points reduction" scoring system? (Please post specific and additional feedback in forum)
Option	Results
Like It : It can be used in future tests after minor adjustments.	13 Votes - [76.47%]
Don't like : It is too complicated and should not be used in future	3 Votes - [17.65%]
Don't care : I'm here just to solve puzzles	1 Votes - [5.88%]

View Results


	@ 2011-04-05 3:40 AM (#3927 - in reply to #3910) (#3927) Top
PuzzleScot Posts: 31 Country : United Kingdom	PuzzleScot posted @ 2011-04-05 3:40 AM Hi, Can you please confirm the times, with time zone, that this contest is available for competing? Note that the UK is currently in British Summer Time (GMT+1) Thanks Alan Edited by PuzzleScot 2011-04-05 3:41 AM
	@ 2011-04-05 6:43 AM (#3928 - in reply to #3927) (#3928) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-05 6:43 AM PuzzleScot - 2011-04-05 3:40 AM Hi, Can you please confirm the times, with time zone, that this contest is available for competing? Note that the UK is currently in British Summer Time (GMT+1) Thanks Alan Done. Please check the submission page.
	@ 2011-04-05 12:32 PM (#3930 - in reply to #3910) (#3930) Top
harmeet Posts: 87 Country : India	harmeet posted @ 2011-04-05 12:32 PM "twist" IB seems to be very interesting. will miss the test this time owing to travel. will take it offline.
	@ 2011-04-06 7:03 AM (#3932 - in reply to #3910) (#3932) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-06 7:03 AM Note about Hitori Sum Answer key This is only puzzle where answer is 'by column'. This is not easy to remember while entering the solution under time-limit. So I decided to mark all the columns as shown below. There is no change in rules or answer key definition.
	@ 2011-04-06 2:46 PM (#3939 - in reply to #3910) (#3939) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-06 2:46 PM Just to make sure that everyone understands the point reduction formula, here is an example. Basically, 'how much you get for a particular puzzle' depends upon 'when you submitted it'. Nothing else.
	@ 2011-04-08 9:52 AM (#3947 - in reply to #3910) (#3947) Top
kiwijam Posts: 187 Country : New Zealand	kiwijam posted @ 2011-04-08 9:52 AM In the answer for the Minesweeper puzzle, there is a mine next to the 4 (left end of second row) that has 3 mines around it. Is this allowed?
	@ 2011-04-08 10:12 AM (#3949 - in reply to #3947) (#3949) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-08 10:12 AM You are referring to R2C1. Yes, that is allowed. The following situation is NOT allowed because of R2C3. Cells with numbers will have exactly same number of mines around them. Cells with mines may have any number of mines around them Cells without numbers and mines can NOT have 3 mines around them. [This is the only rule change wrt a standard Minesweeper puzzle ]
	@ 2011-04-08 10:17 AM (#3950 - in reply to #3910) (#3950) Top
kiwijam Posts: 187 Country : New Zealand	kiwijam posted @ 2011-04-08 10:17 AM Ah thank you. I thought it meant: (Cells without numbers) and mines can NOT have 3 mines around them instead of: Cells without (numbers and mines) can NOT have 3 mines around them Looking forward to trying these twists. The hitori sum is my favourite new idea, normally the numbers just get ignored.
	@ 2011-04-08 10:24 AM (#3951 - in reply to #3950) (#3951) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-08 10:24 AM During IB review itself, we found that the wording is little cryptic. So I included the example such that all the scenarios are reflected. Hope it is clear to all.
	@ 2011-04-08 9:44 PM (#3952 - in reply to #3950) (#3952) Top
brianklimek Posts: 14 Country : United States	brianklimek posted @ 2011-04-08 9:44 PM Ah, glad this was addressed, I just logged on to check on the same thing, and I had misinterpretted the instructions the same way. Thanks. I look forward to this one. Thanks again to the organizers and creators!
	@ 2011-04-08 10:29 PM (#3953 - in reply to #3910) (#3953) Top
Administrator Country : India	Administrator posted @ 2011-04-08 10:29 PM Puzzle Booklet uploaded. It has 12 pages, each page has 2 puzzles (and instructions and solution to the example) of one particular type. There is no cover page.
	@ 2011-04-09 5:33 AM (#3954 - in reply to #3910) (#3954) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 5:33 AM Twist has started. Good luck everyone!
	@ 2011-04-09 10:45 AM (#3955 - in reply to #3954) (#3955) Top
motris Posts: 199 Country : United States	motris posted @ 2011-04-09 10:45 AM Wow! Phenomenal test with a nice balance of difficulties and many fun puzzles on both ends of the spectrum. The twists were very interesting, and you even managed to make Hitori fun! You don't know how much that means to me. Thanks a lot Deb.
	@ 2011-04-09 10:50 AM (#3956 - in reply to #3910) (#3956) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 10:50 AM The score page doesn't show the bonus properly. Will be uploading fixed score page in few minutes
	@ 2011-04-09 11:00 AM (#3957 - in reply to #3956) (#3957) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 11:00 AM debmohanty - 2011-04-09 10:50 AM The score page doesn't show the bonus properly. Will be uploading fixed score page in few minutes Bonus should show up properly now - here is the link to score page - http://logicmastersindia.com/M201104P/score.asp - which you can view after you complete the test. A twisted view of the score page available here - http://logicmastersindia.com/M201104P/score.asp?view=twist
	@ 2011-04-09 11:40 AM (#3958 - in reply to #3955) (#3958) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 11:40 AM motris - 2011-04-09 10:45 AM Wow! Phenomenal test with a nice balance of difficulties and many fun puzzles on both ends of the spectrum. The twists were very interesting, and you even managed to make Hitori fun! You don't know how much that means to me. Thanks a lot Deb. Thanks a lot for the feedback. Yes, Hitori is a type that is not liked by all. I'm glad that the 2 Hitoris came out well and you liked them.
	@ 2011-04-09 1:24 PM (#3961 - in reply to #3910) (#3961) Top
Para Posts: 315 Country : The Netherlands	Para posted @ 2011-04-09 1:24 PM Thanks for the test. I had fun. My favourite was the ABC twist, really good puzzles both. And I managed to avoid making any entry errors, although I did take a very cautious approach entering my answer keys this time, probably cost me some time as I doublechecked what I had put in each time.
	@ 2011-04-09 1:26 PM (#3962 - in reply to #3939) (#3962) Top
anurag Posts: 136 Country : India	anurag posted @ 2011-04-09 1:26 PM thats a nice clarification.before looking at this post,i was surprised about the reduction as i thought it was calculated on the total score.This logic i think should be posted on the contest page too,to ensure no one is in doubt.
	@ 2011-04-09 1:38 PM (#3963 - in reply to #3962) (#3963) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 1:38 PM anurag - 2011-04-09 1:26 PM thats a nice clarification.before looking at this post,i was surprised about the reduction as i thought it was calculated on the total score.This logic i think should be posted on the contest page too,to ensure no one is in doubt. We've experimented with many bonus systems, not all of them are flawless - but we'll never have a bonus system where players need calculators (more than pencil and eraser) before submitting a puzzle.
	@ 2011-04-09 1:46 PM (#3964 - in reply to #3963) (#3964) Top
anurag Posts: 136 Country : India	anurag posted @ 2011-04-09 1:46 PM that sounded funny.i didnt say the contestants would start calculating.in fact i liked this penalty(bonus)system:) Good and simple one. To make it better,why not increase the number of intervals and make it 6 ,of 5 mins each.That can probably sharpen the evaluation.
	@ 2011-04-09 1:54 PM (#3965 - in reply to #3964) (#3965) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 1:54 PM anurag - 2011-04-09 1:46 PM that sounded funny.i didnt say the contestants would start calculating.in fact i liked this penalty(bonus)system:) Good and simple one. To make it better,why not increase the number of intervals and make it 6 ,of 5 mins each.That can probably sharpen the evaluation. Changing the interval to 5 minutes is an option. But it might become too stressful for players in last 30 minutes. As the poll options indicate, we definitely can make adjustments to this system in future.
	@ 2011-04-09 2:17 PM (#3966 - in reply to #3965) (#3966) Top
rakesh_rai Posts: 774 Country : India	rakesh_rai posted @ 2011-04-09 2:17 PM Nice twists. I liked L&M&I, Lights and Hitori Sum the most.
	@ 2011-04-09 2:36 PM (#3967 - in reply to #3910) (#3967) Top
anurag Posts: 136 Country : India	anurag posted @ 2011-04-09 2:36 PM a question off the topic..I want to know if the preliminary online is all we need to give(as it used to be every year) ,or the regional rounds are required too?
	@ 2011-04-09 5:25 PM (#3968 - in reply to #3910) (#3968) Top
anurag Posts: 136 Country : India	anurag posted @ 2011-04-09 5:25 PM Odd skyscraper: Some evens inside look like valid skyscrapers .The 2,4 in the third row can be valid and satsify the outside '3' at the same time.Is that a problem with the example? or will that hold for the test puzzle too? Edited by anurag 2011-04-09 5:30 PM
	@ 2011-04-09 6:10 PM (#3969 - in reply to #3968) (#3969) Top
debmohanty Country : India	debmohanty posted @ 2011-04-09 6:10 PM anurag - 2011-04-09 5:25 PM Odd skyscraper: Some evens inside look like valid skyscrapers .The 2,4 in the third row can be valid and satsify the outside '3' at the same time.Is that a problem with the example? or will that hold for the test puzzle too? I think the rule and the example match perfectly.