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Administrator
   
Country : India | |
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Administrator
Country : India | Some notes about April Contest 2019Please note this contest will have a slightly different format than regular LMI tests.
Key differences from regular LMI tests:
• There is no IB (i.e. no Instructions Booklet). If you have any questions about any puzzle, please ask here.
• The PB (Puzzle Booklet) does not have any password.
• You can download the pdf and start solving. Login at the contest page to start submitting.
• There is no time limit. You can submit until the contest ends.
• There will be some optimizer puzzles. Other puzzles will be very hard (compared to regular LMI tests)
• Same scores will have same rank (i.e. early submissions do not count towards rank)
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Puzlifouk
Posts: 67
Country : France | Hello everybody,
Is it good for today? I'm so impatient: I took my leave for that. |
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Administrator
Country : India | |
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Puzlifouk
Posts: 67
Country : France | Great! |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-03 11:06 PM Ships: As it is not mentioned on the file, I assume the fragments are pulled out straight without rotation and can be put back the same way as they are. Also, the column clues consider all 10 cells and not just the 5-cell strip. |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-03 11:19 PM Distyle: these puzzles usually do not allow 2x2 squares of shaded cells (except paint by number). What about this one? There is no mention.
Solving the example does not help deuce the rule either way as it can be solved uniquely without having to consider 2x2 squares.
Edited by anurag 2019-04-03 11:31 PM
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kiwijam
Posts: 187
Country : New Zealand | kiwijam posted @ 2019-04-04 5:01 AM Pentocolour:
1) Can a black pentomino diagonally touch an orange pentomino with the same letter?
2) Please explain how to calculate K. In mathematics, two different-sized squares are 'similar'. Is this the count of different white shapes (different after rotation and reflection)? So if I have a horizontal white domino and a vertical white domino, then K=1? |
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | Puzlifouk - 2019-04-03 11:13 AM
Hello everybody,
Is it good for today? I'm so impatient: I took my leave for that.
I wish you success! |
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | anurag - 2019-04-03 11:06 PM
Ships: As it is not mentioned on the file, I assume the fragments are pulled out straight without rotation and can be put back the same way as they are. Also, the column clues consider all 10 cells and not just the 5-cell strip.
Ships can be rotated. The column clues consider all 10 cells. |
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | anurag - 2019-04-03 11:19 PM
Distyle: these puzzles usually do not allow 2x2 squares of shaded cells (except paint by number). What about this one? There is no mention.
Solving the example does not help deuce the rule either way as it can be solved uniquely without having to consider 2x2 squares.
The 2 x 2 squares can be shaded. |
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | kiwijam - 2019-04-04 5:01 AM
Pentocolour:
1) Can a black pentomino diagonally touch an orange pentomino with the same letter?
2) Please explain how to calculate K. In mathematics, two different-sized squares are 'similar'. Is this the count of different white shapes (different after rotation and reflection)? So if I have a horizontal white domino and a vertical white domino, then K=1?
1 ) No.
2 ) If there are several white dominoes in the grid, then K=1. If several different white triminoes, then K=2. White square 1 x 1 and white square 2 x 2 - different shapes, K=2.
If you still have doubts about the translation, I am ready to comment.
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Léotte
Posts: 1
Country : France | Léotte posted @ 2019-04-04 2:20 PM At the levers : can you check for the solution? I may be mistaken (of course!), but I really see no solution here :/ |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-04 2:54 PM No, not ships. I was asking about the 5x10 fragments. But nevermind, I solved it. It was fun. |
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Administrator
Country : India | Submission page
The Submission page is now ready: http://logicmastersindia.com/2019/04Contest/
You can submit your answer keys now. There is no instant grading in this test.
(Potential ) Results link shows possible points based on submissions, even if incorrect.
Some of the answer keys (mainly for Optimizers ) may show red validation messages. They can be ignored if you think your answer key is right.
Submissions should be completed by 10th April midnight (Moscow time ).
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Puzlifouk
Posts: 67
Country : France | A remark about Magic Tapa : because we always have R>=r and C>=c, minimizing (|R-r|-r + |C-c|-c) is always exactly the same thing than minimizing (R-2r+C-2c). Right? |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-04 11:47 PM ROFL.. you are right. That's a print error. Perhaps it was intended like this: the closing pipe comes after the third 'r'. |R-r-r| + C-c-c| |
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kiwijam
Posts: 187
Country : New Zealand | kiwijam posted @ 2019-04-05 3:47 AM At The Levers: Does the small example have two solutions? When I put "3-3" on the diagonal lever it also works, or is this not allowed? |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-05 9:32 AM It appears the objective here is to maximize the row min and column min, as also indicated by the revealing title. Maximize (r+c) could be a simpler scoring formula. |
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L00ping007
Posts: 11
Country : France | kiwijam - 2019-04-04 11:47 PM
At The Levers: Does the small example have two solutions? When I put "3-3" on the diagonal lever it also works, or is this not allowed?
I agree, the 2 solutions work for me
Léotte - 2019-04-04 10:20 AM
At the levers : can you check for the solution? I may be mistaken (of course!), but I really see no solution here :/
Same for me ... My step by step logic way leads to a dead end 
Do we miss something here ?  |
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | Léotte - 2019-04-04 2:20 PM
At the levers : can you check for the solution? I may be mistaken (of course!), but I really see no solution here :/
4 testers solved this puzzle. |
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | Puzlifouk - 2019-04-04 10:05 PM
A remark about Magic Tapa : because we always have R>=r and C>=c, minimizing (|R-r|-r + |C-c|-c) is always exactly the same thing than minimizing (R-2r+C-2c). Right?
Convert the expression as you like. |
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | anurag - 2019-04-04 11:47 PM
ROFL.. you are right. That's a print error. Perhaps it was intended like this: the closing pipe comes after the third 'r'. |R-r-r| + C-c-c|
There is no printer error. Some of the puzzles I've made in 2015 and corrected in 2019. I modified the problem, but the expression is correct. |
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | kiwijam - 2019-04-05 3:47 AM
At The Levers: Does the small example have two solutions? When I put "3-3" on the diagonal lever it also works, or is this not allowed?
Thanks for the comment, I'll correct the example. |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-05 2:38 PM Strange. Are you saying sub-zero scores are valid and considered as more rewarding than a score of 0? |
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kiwijam
Posts: 187
Country : New Zealand | kiwijam posted @ 2019-04-05 3:13 PM Anurag, please show respect to Riad, I'm much enjoying the effort he has done for this competition.
I think the Magic Tapa expression is clear and makes sense as it is (range minus minimum). As he says, you can maximize whatever you like but the final scores will be based on the official expression.
And yes, a score of -1 would be better than a score of 0 if you can achieve that. If there are other negative scores then the most negative score would be the best. |
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Puzlifouk
Posts: 67
Country : France | I do not know what "score" you are talking about when you say "And yes, a score of -1 would be better than a score of 0 if you can achieve that. If there are other negative scores then the most negative score would be the best."
If the score is the final score to maximize (that is | R-r | -r + | C-c | -c), then personally I have never seen that -1> 0 nor -10 > -5 !?! ... But you are free: as you say the expression is clear, everybody will interpret as he wants. |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-05 5:13 PM That's Correct and clears the doubt, at least for some.
The whole purpose of asking questions is to be able to complete the set and I am sure puzzle solving is not an objectionable activity. For any unrelated suggestions/objections, I believe personal emails are a better medium. |
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Administrator
Country : India | anurag - 2019-04-04 11:47 PM
ROFL.. We request everyone to please stick to "English" on this forum. Thanks. |
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3strikerz
Posts: 8
Country : South Korea | anurag - 2019-04-03 11:06 PM
Ships: As it is not mentioned on the file, I assume the fragments are pulled out straight without rotation and can be put back the same way as they are. Also, the column clues consider all 10 cells and not just the 5-cell strip.
Probably everyone might have understood the puzzle description, but since I didn't and need some clarification;
A )Is the red clues in the 5x10 fragments intended to be solved as 5x10 battleship clues, or is the red clues the equivalent of 10x10 original battleship clues?
B )Is it okay for ships to be 'fragmented' in the 5x10 clues? |
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Puzlifouk
Posts: 67
Country : France | Very sorry all, the expression has to be minimized! So everything is clear and ok, I will not comment this point any more. |
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | In puzzle 11, I will remove the brackets, if it is principled. Minimize the expression R – 2r + C – 2c. James rightly noted that the minimum can be negative.
In puzzle 7, the red clues extend to 10 cells.
Edited by Riad Khanmagomedov 2019-04-05 7:20 PM
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randomperson1729
Posts: 11
Country : United States | I have a question about "at the levers."
If two digits are on one side of the balance, is each one multiplied by its distance from the balance? So if there are two digits next to each other on the pivot, with the closest one unit away from the pivot, would the total for that side be thw closer digit plus twice the outer digit? |
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ghirsch
Posts: 102
Country : United States | ghirsch posted @ 2019-04-06 12:13 AM It looks like the example for dice masyu has multiple solutions, can you confirm if this is a mistake or if I am misunderstanding a rule?  (Screen Shot 2019-04-05 at 2.41.26 PM.png)Attachments ----------------  Screen Shot 2019-04-05 at 2.41.26 PM.png (32KB - 1 downloads) |
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deu
Posts: 69
Country : Japan | deu posted @ 2019-04-06 11:55 AM In Fragments of Seas, is it allowed to rotate and/or reflect fragments? |
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kiwijam
Posts: 187
Country : New Zealand | kiwijam posted @ 2019-04-06 2:07 PM @randomperson1729: Exactly right.
@ghirsch: The Dice Masyu example has multiple solutions, but the big puzzle has only one solution.
@deu: No, the 10x5 rectangles can not be rotated or reflected. |
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Administrator
Country : India | Puzzle BookletAn updated version of Puzzle Booklet can now be downloaded.
Changes:
1) Puzzle 6: Correction to the example
2) Puzzle 11: Removed the brackets for the expression to be minimized
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Badacoin
Posts: 4
Country : France | 7. Fragments of Sea:
Can two grids use the same ship type?
8. Dice Masyu
What happens when you place a dice on top of an existing circle? Does the position of this existing circle have to match the position of a circle on the dice? |
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Puzlifouk
Posts: 67
Country : France | A small question again, about "Fragments of seas" : is there 1 fragment from each grid, or is it possible that 2 fragments come from the same grid, and no fragment come from another grid? |
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rakesh_rai
Posts: 774
Country : India | Puzlifouk - 2019-04-07 1:10 PM
A small question again, about "Fragments of seas" : is there 1 fragment from each grid, or is it possible that 2 fragments come from the same grid, and no fragment come from another grid? one fragment from each grid |
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Badacoin
Posts: 4
Country : France | I'd like some clarification about Dice Masyu.
What happens when you place a dice on top of an existing circle? Must the position of the existing circle match the position of a circle on the dice?
Do all existing circles in the grid belong to a dice?
Edit: Sorry for the double post, I thought I made a mistake and didn't correctly submit the first one
Edited by Badacoin 2019-04-07 3:29 PM
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rakesh_rai
Posts: 774
Country : India | Badacoin - 2019-04-07 1:54 AM
7. Fragments of Sea:
Can two grids use the same ship type?
One type in each grid. The answer to your question is "NO." |
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GaS
Posts: 24
Country : ITALY | GaS posted @ 2019-04-07 7:03 PM Hi all,
what about multiple submission for optimizer puzzles? There is reduction of potential score, as for usual LMI contest, or are allowed without impact on the score?
Thanks
Gabriele |
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rakesh_rai
Posts: 774
Country : India | GaS - 2019-04-07 7:03 PM
Hi all,
what about multiple submission for optimizer puzzles? There is reduction of potential score, as for usual LMI contest, or are allowed without impact on the score?
Thanks
Gabriele
Last submission will be considered. There is no penalty as there is no instant grading. |
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Eugene Porter
Posts: 11
Country : United States | Hi there I am enjoying your contest. It is very well done. I do have a question about Dice Maysu. If you cover an existing circle with a half domino is it still 'seen'? For example, if one were to place a domino of six such that a pre-existing circle would be the middle of that six after placement --- would the middle circle be covered ? Would the circle be 'in play' along with the rest of the domino ? Or would one not be allowed to place a domino of 6 in such a location?
Thanks -E |
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kiwijam
Posts: 187
Country : New Zealand | kiwijam posted @ 2019-04-08 10:40 AM In Dice Masyu, every given circle must match a half-domino circle.
e.g. You cannot place a 6-domino such that the centre cell of the 6 covers an existing circle.
And you cannot have an existing circle with no half-domino covering it. |
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | Thanks for the comments, I will consider everything (including those received by mail) and update the file later. |
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L00ping007
Posts: 11
Country : France | I understood my mistake on Levers, and finally solved it ! So my earlier post can be trashed ... 
I also just solved "Crossword with tips". Great puzzle ! I loved it
But I was surprised to find multiple distinct solutions to this puzzle (i found 5 )
However, the marked diagonal is the same for these 5 solutions, so no matter.
Are you aware of these multiple solutions, or do you want me to provide them to you ? |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-09 12:20 AM Hey Looping,
It is interesting that you managed to find 5 solutions. If it really does have multiple solutions as you say, it is not 'ok' just because the answer key is unique. Answer keys are there only to allow for claiming that one has solved the puzzle.
Edited by anurag 2019-04-09 12:23 AM
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randomperson1729
Posts: 11
Country : United States | I have a question about distyle.
In the rows at the edges of the board, do the gaps count as white squares, or are two black dominoes across a gap counted as part of one black grouping? |
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deu
Posts: 69
Country : Japan | deu posted @ 2019-04-09 5:17 AM L00ping007 - 2019-04-08 10:08 PM
I also just solved "Crossword with tips". Great puzzle ! I loved it
But I was surprised to find multiple distinct solutions to this puzzle (i found 5)
However, the marked diagonal is the same for these 5 solutions, so no matter.
Are you aware of these multiple solutions, or do you want me to provide them to you ?
I also found 5 solutions to this puzzle. As marked diagonal is the same for all of them, I submitted that common diagonal.
(If organizers need alternative solutions, I can send them. )
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Administrator
Country : India | Puzzle BookletAn updated version of Puzzle Booklet can now be downloaded.
Changes:
1) Puzzle 8: Correction to the example
2) Puzzle 9: Removed the name JAYANT from the given options
Those who have already solved and submitted answer (for puzzle 9) need not submit again. Those who have not solved yet can use the updated pdf.
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Badacoin
Posts: 4
Country : France | Once the contest is over, I'd like someone to send me those alternate solutions, as I completely missed them during my solve. |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-09 10:23 PM Tapa's answer key is as taxing as solving the puzzle itself. 12,0,7,0,6,0,....format would have been far easier. |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-09 11:06 PM Tapa: The focus in red background next to the text input will not go. It is there eternally even after entering the answer key string. Is something wrong with that part of the page? I would be glad if the admin can confirm the answer key was received. |
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Administrator
Country : India | anurag - 2019-04-09 11:06 PM
Tapa: The focus in red background next to the text input will not go. It is there eternally even after entering the answer key string. Is something wrong with that part of the page? I would be glad if the admin can confirm the answer key was received.
http://logicmastersindia.com/forum/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=2695&...
Your last submission was received on 9th April 11:12 pm. |
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debmohanty
Country : India | |
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kiwijam
Posts: 187
Country : New Zealand | kiwijam posted @ 2019-04-11 9:27 AM I can see a couple of optimizers (not mine) with single cell mistakes, presumably from entering the long answer keys.
Do we have a rule for these situations? I don't feel that 0 is fair if they put hours(?) of work in.
Edited by kiwijam 2019-04-11 9:44 AM
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-11 10:32 AM Pento: I thought 41 was possible, but I don't see any. There is only one submission with 40 points. |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2019-04-11 12:13 PM 7 solutions actually, with a score of 40.
Edited by anurag 2019-04-11 12:13 PM
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | It is not always possible to organize a competition perfectly, I admit.
During the checking optimization answers, I took into account a few moments:
PENTOCOLOUR. Without points those answers where the same pentaminoes touched or the same black pentaminoes met twice. Taner instead of the claimed 42 points scored 40. Henna, Pierdante and Eugene's answers contained extra orange and black cells, but I figured it out.
MAGIC TAPA. Anthea missed twice: in the top row instead of (12) he indicated (3), and (23) placed in the 4th row (it was necessary in the 2nd). KuroTent placed (23) in the 8th row, not in the 9th. I counted them the claimed points. Shinichi do not score points, because in his puzzle multiple solutions.
MAXIDOMINO. Kazuya lured places 1, 3 and 4, Vladimir changed 1 and 2. I awarded them points. Anurag and Nicholas are not score points, because in their puzzles are multiple solutions.
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Riad Khanmagomedov
Posts: 234
Country : Russia | I congratulate James, Christian and Tomoya!
In the final table, the scores for the 7th puzzle are rounded (8 instead of 7.5 and 3 instead of 2.5).
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Mihalich
Posts: 26
Country : Ukraine | Riad, thank you for the very interesting tasks! As always, your assignments are simply unique! Sorry, I did not have enough time to show a more decent result. It's amazing that you noticed my flaw on MAXIDOMINO (replacement 1 and 2) - thanks for the reward! And it is surprising that you didn’t notice my failure to refine PENTOCOLOUR (replacement of black L and V), which would give 37 and +6 points to the final table. This is how your appetite for your attentiveness grows!) I apologize that it may have frightened someone who counted himself 74 in PENTOCOLOUR - does the orange color of pentamino are so much worse than black not to count orange?) I'm already looking forward to your new habitually unusual and interesting tasks! Thank you for the good work! |
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kousek-nebe
Posts: 20
Country : Czech Republic | I would like to thank Riad for beautifully though contest, as usual. :-) My favourite pieces were Sumino and Dice Masyu, meanwhile, I broke twice the Crossword because I did not realize one extra possible combination at the top of the puzzle. In optimization I am still such a beginner, but we will see next time. :-) I am looking forward to it. Thanks once more. |
