Thread - Times Sudoku Championship 2013

@ 2013-07-15 11:13 PM (#11749 - in reply to #11748) (#11749) Top

Posts: 9

ashu posted @ 2013-07-15 11:13 PM

prasanna16391 - 2013-07-15 11:08 PM

From last year's experience, it just means that the participants completing the round qualify for the next round. There's no reason to consider bonuses as everyone who completes this round goes through to the next one (again, according to last year). Either way, don't worry about format and bonus and all too much (I did last year and got knocked out because of that

). There'll be detailed explanations about the format and all at the event anyway, so just practice a little, enjoy the experience, and maybe follow up here to participate in future online contests and build on your solving level and interest.

dont mind if i ask you...how're the finalists selected then...

and the difficulty level...is it as easy as delhi times...or regional times newsppr...or somewhat difficult...........more that is like the one displayed on http://prasannaseshadri.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/frame.png?

Edited by ashu 2013-07-15 11:18 PM

@ 2013-07-15 11:19 PM (#11750 - in reply to #11749) (#11750) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-15 11:19 PM

ashu - 2013-07-15 11:13 PM

dont mind if i ask you...how're the finalists selected then...

Well, that's the second round (its why there's an instruction to stay around in case you're called back). The second round, last year, was actually the format that LMI Beginners' Sudoku Contests is based on. The first one back in July (see links on the right) had the exact same variants too.

Obviously this is all just unofficial information based on my experience last year. Its all a bit unclear for now this year, but the 15 minute round makes me think it'll be pretty similar. Either way, like I said, the format will mostly be announced in detail at the event.

@ 2013-07-15 11:22 PM (#11751 - in reply to #11749) (#11751) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-15 11:22 PM

ashu - 2013-07-15 11:13 PM

and the difficulty level...is it as easy as delhi times...or regional times newsppr...or somewhat difficult...........more that is like the one displayed on http://prasannaseshadri.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/frame.png?

I don't think the preliminaries will have something like that at least. As I said, the Beginners' Contests are a more accurate description of round 2.

@ 2013-07-15 11:29 PM (#11752 - in reply to #11751) (#11752) Top

ashu

Posts: 9

ashu posted @ 2013-07-15 11:29 PM

prasanna16391 - 2013-07-15 11:22 PM

I don't think the preliminaries will have something like that at least. As I said, the Beginners' Contests are a more accurate description of round 2.

okay...so we can say k ...its gonna be a bit similar to what comes in any...."easy"category sudoku...?
and.......umm
so there's no time limit thingy...we hv like 15 minutes...for one sudoku puzzle...thats it.....?

@ 2013-07-15 11:40 PM (#11753 - in reply to #11752) (#11753) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-15 11:40 PM

ashu - 2013-07-15 11:29 PM
okay...so we can say k ...its gonna be a bit similar to what comes in any...."easy"category sudoku...?
and.......umm
so there's no time limit thingy...we hv like 15 minutes...for one sudoku puzzle...thats it.....?

You mean on my blog? My blog's easy category would probably be equivalent to one of the higher pointers in round 2

The best practice you can possibly get in this short time span is to go and solve Beginners' Sudoku Contest July. If you do that, you'll be well equipped for last year's 2nd round standards.

Either the instructions are misleading here or they've changed the format from last year. Last year, we had 8 6x6 Sudokus to finish in the 15 minutes. I know 8's a lot more than 1, but 6x6s are pretty easy so if its the same it should be pretty finishable.

@ 2013-07-15 11:46 PM (#11754 - in reply to #11753) (#11754) Top

ashu

Posts: 9

ashu posted @ 2013-07-15 11:46 PM

prasanna16391 - 2013-07-15 11:40 PM

You mean on my blog? My blog's easy category would probably be equivalent to one of the higher pointers in round 2

hahahahahaha....okay okay...... :D hoping for the best :))
nice talking to you.. :))
thanx a tonne..

@ 2013-07-15 11:47 PM (#11755 - in reply to #11754) (#11755) Top

ashu

Posts: 9

ashu posted @ 2013-07-15 11:47 PM

ashu - 2013-07-15 11:46 PM

prasanna16391 - 2013-07-15 11:40 PM

You mean on my blog? My blog's easy category would probably be equivalent to one of the higher pointers in round 2

hahahahahaha....okay okay...... :D hoping for the best :))
nice talking to you.. :))
thanx a tonne..

achha haan...
umm...the classic ones or the variants tooo :P

@ 2013-07-15 11:56 PM (#11756 - in reply to #11755) (#11756) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-15 11:56 PM

ashu - 2013-07-15 11:47 PM

achha haan...
umm...the classic ones or the variants tooo :P

The variants too. Thats why I pointed specifically to the July edition. Same variants as last year.

@ 2013-07-16 6:56 AM (#11757 - in reply to #11711) (#11757) Top

devarajand

Posts: 114

Country : India

devarajand posted @ 2013-07-16 6:56 AM

Is this competition is only for metro living people. Why there is no on line round.

@ 2013-07-16 4:12 PM (#11776 - in reply to #11757) (#11776) Top

rakesh_rai

Posts: 774

Country : India

rakesh_rai posted @ 2013-07-16 4:12 PM

devarajand - 2013-07-16 6:56 AM

Is this competition is only for metro living people. Why there is no online round.

This year (like last year), it is happening in four metros only. If you want to participate you will need to travel to one of these cities on the given dates, as there is no online round this time.

@ 2013-07-19 10:02 PM (#11815 - in reply to #11711) (#11815) Top

rvarun

Posts: 268

Country : India

rvarun posted @ 2013-07-19 10:02 PM

All the Best for the participants for this weekend's rounds in Chennai and Delhi. :)

@ 2013-07-20 11:08 AM (#11817 - in reply to #11711) (#11817) Top

babuli

Posts: 4

Country : India

babuli posted @ 2013-07-20 11:08 AM

Do we have any info. about the types of sudoku for the regional rounds.

@ 2013-07-20 5:21 PM (#11819 - in reply to #11817) (#11819) Top

rvarun

Posts: 268

Country : India

rvarun posted @ 2013-07-20 5:21 PM

A great Congrats chennai round winners..

1. Rishi Puri
2. Ezhilarasi
3. Kishore kumar
3. Jaipal Reddy

@ 2013-07-20 5:25 PM (#11820 - in reply to #11819) (#11820) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-20 5:25 PM

Congrats to the 4 :) Hopefully I make it in Mumbai and finally get to meet and compete against Rishi in person. Also, good show by Kishore to out-score Jaipal. Congrats to the person at 2nd, not sure if its a newcomer or some member here who I'm forgetting. Either way, finishing ahead of Kishore and Jaipal is quite good.

@ 2013-07-20 5:33 PM (#11822 - in reply to #11820) (#11822) Top

rakesh_rai

Posts: 774

Country : India

rakesh_rai posted @ 2013-07-20 5:33 PM

Kishore and Jaipal were joint third, submitting in 42 minutes. Ezhilarasi finished in 40 minutes. Rishi in 26 minutes.

@ 2013-07-20 6:31 PM (#11823 - in reply to #11711) (#11823) Top

ssandy

Posts: 5

Country : India

ssandy posted @ 2013-07-20 6:31 PM

congrats to all the winners and a very good show overall too at chennai

@ 2013-07-20 8:33 PM (#11824 - in reply to #11711) (#11824) Top

rajeshk

Posts: 542

Country : India

rajeshk posted @ 2013-07-20 8:33 PM

Congrats to all the winners of Chennai round. Best of luck to Delhi participants.

@ 2013-07-20 10:31 PM (#11827 - in reply to #11824) (#11827) Top

ashu

Posts: 9

ashu posted @ 2013-07-20 10:31 PM

rajeshk - 2013-07-20 8:33 PM

Congrats to all the winners of Chennai round. Best of luck to Delhi participants.

can u plz help me with the typ of puzzles we'll be getting at delhi round....
mine is tomorrow...

@ 2013-07-20 10:47 PM (#11829 - in reply to #11827) (#11829) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-20 10:47 PM

ashu - 2013-07-20 10:31 PM

can u plz help me with the typ of puzzles we'll be getting at delhi round....
mine is tomorrow...

Well, having spoken to Chennai Round winner Rishi, the structure seems to be largely similar to last year's. The first round is 6x6s (last year had 8) to be solved in 15 minutes, and the second round seems to be the same 4 classic/4 variant structure as last year, with the only difference being that instead of two rounds of 30 minutes each, it is one round of 60 minutes (hence the timings of 40 and 42 for 2nd and 3rd places).

@ 2013-07-20 11:55 PM (#11830 - in reply to #11711) (#11830) Top

shera90

Posts: 71

Country : India

shera90 posted @ 2013-07-20 11:55 PM

The regional rounds I think are biased completely ignoring EAST ZONE focussing only on west and south zones of India. With such short notice, how can one living in eastern zone states like West Bengal, Bihar, Assam etc. plan their travel and stay.

Edited by shera90 2013-07-20 11:57 PM

@ 2013-07-21 12:08 AM (#11831 - in reply to #11711) (#11831) Top

ashu

Posts: 9

ashu posted @ 2013-07-21 12:08 AM

can we bring any number of sheets... :D :P

@ 2013-07-21 12:17 AM (#11832 - in reply to #11711) (#11832) Top

ashu

Posts: 9

ashu posted @ 2013-07-21 12:17 AM

and prasanna....r u on fb... :D

@ 2013-07-21 12:57 AM (#11833 - in reply to #11831) (#11833) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-21 12:57 AM

ashu - 2013-07-21 12:08 AM

can we bring any number of sheets... :D :P

You mean rough work sheets? Yes of course, I think so. I'll wait for the organizers to confirm but I don't see how that helps gain any unfair advantage, since in the end you'll have to submit the booklet that's provided only.

@ 2013-07-21 8:44 AM (#11834 - in reply to #11711) (#11834) Top

kishy72

Posts: 419

Country : India

kishy72 posted @ 2013-07-21 8:44 AM

It was an enjoyable yesterday at the event for me and 2 of my other friends.Sudokus were of a very good quality and it was nice solving all of them.I also got to speak a little with some of the bigwigs in Indian sudoku who otherwise came out as very humble and soft spoken to me .
Here's the article in Times of India,Chennai edition.They have made a mistake though(not the first time i think :)?!).I was joint third and not the second to complete .

http://epaper.timesofindia.com/Default/Scripting/ArticleWin.asp?Fro...

Edited by kishy72 2013-07-21 8:45 AM

@ 2013-07-21 2:29 PM (#11836 - in reply to #11834) (#11836) Top

rvarun

Posts: 268

Country : India

rvarun posted @ 2013-07-21 2:29 PM

A great day with good organization. The puzzles were too good and it was nice to be part of the city finals one more time. Congrats Kishore and Ezhilarasi, the new faces from Chennai in National Round. :-)

Nice to meet Rakesh, Rishi and Jaipal and interacting with them for first time was a nice experience.

All the best to the participants of the Delhi round of TSC 2013.

Edited by rvarun 2013-07-21 2:41 PM


	@ 2013-07-15 11:13 PM (#11749 - in reply to #11748) (#11749) Top
ashu Posts: 9	ashu posted @ 2013-07-15 11:13 PM prasanna16391 - 2013-07-15 11:08 PM From last year's experience, it just means that the participants completing the round qualify for the next round. There's no reason to consider bonuses as everyone who completes this round goes through to the next one (again, according to last year). Either way, don't worry about format and bonus and all too much (I did last year and got knocked out because of that ). There'll be detailed explanations about the format and all at the event anyway, so just practice a little, enjoy the experience, and maybe follow up here to participate in future online contests and build on your solving level and interest. dont mind if i ask you...how're the finalists selected then... and the difficulty level...is it as easy as delhi times...or regional times newsppr...or somewhat difficult...........more that is like the one displayed on http://prasannaseshadri.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/frame.png? Edited by ashu 2013-07-15 11:18 PM
	@ 2013-07-15 11:19 PM (#11750 - in reply to #11749) (#11750) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-15 11:19 PM ashu - 2013-07-15 11:13 PM prasanna16391 - 2013-07-15 11:08 PM From last year's experience, it just means that the participants completing the round qualify for the next round. There's no reason to consider bonuses as everyone who completes this round goes through to the next one (again, according to last year). Either way, don't worry about format and bonus and all too much (I did last year and got knocked out because of that ). There'll be detailed explanations about the format and all at the event anyway, so just practice a little, enjoy the experience, and maybe follow up here to participate in future online contests and build on your solving level and interest. dont mind if i ask you...how're the finalists selected then... Well, that's the second round (its why there's an instruction to stay around in case you're called back). The second round, last year, was actually the format that LMI Beginners' Sudoku Contests is based on. The first one back in July (see links on the right) had the exact same variants too. Obviously this is all just unofficial information based on my experience last year. Its all a bit unclear for now this year, but the 15 minute round makes me think it'll be pretty similar. Either way, like I said, the format will mostly be announced in detail at the event.
	@ 2013-07-15 11:22 PM (#11751 - in reply to #11749) (#11751) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-15 11:22 PM ashu - 2013-07-15 11:13 PM and the difficulty level...is it as easy as delhi times...or regional times newsppr...or somewhat difficult...........more that is like the one displayed on http://prasannaseshadri.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/frame.png? I don't think the preliminaries will have something like that at least. As I said, the Beginners' Contests are a more accurate description of round 2.
	@ 2013-07-15 11:29 PM (#11752 - in reply to #11751) (#11752) Top
ashu Posts: 9	ashu posted @ 2013-07-15 11:29 PM prasanna16391 - 2013-07-15 11:22 PM ashu - 2013-07-15 11:13 PM and the difficulty level...is it as easy as delhi times...or regional times newsppr...or somewhat difficult...........more that is like the one displayed on http://prasannaseshadri.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/frame.png? I don't think the preliminaries will have something like that at least. As I said, the Beginners' Contests are a more accurate description of round 2. okay...so we can say k ...its gonna be a bit similar to what comes in any...."easy"category sudoku...? and.......umm so there's no time limit thingy...we hv like 15 minutes...for one sudoku puzzle...thats it.....?
	@ 2013-07-15 11:40 PM (#11753 - in reply to #11752) (#11753) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-15 11:40 PM ashu - 2013-07-15 11:29 PM okay...so we can say k ...its gonna be a bit similar to what comes in any...."easy"category sudoku...? and.......umm so there's no time limit thingy...we hv like 15 minutes...for one sudoku puzzle...thats it.....? You mean on my blog? My blog's easy category would probably be equivalent to one of the higher pointers in round 2 The best practice you can possibly get in this short time span is to go and solve Beginners' Sudoku Contest July. If you do that, you'll be well equipped for last year's 2nd round standards. Either the instructions are misleading here or they've changed the format from last year. Last year, we had 8 6x6 Sudokus to finish in the 15 minutes. I know 8's a lot more than 1, but 6x6s are pretty easy so if its the same it should be pretty finishable.
	@ 2013-07-15 11:46 PM (#11754 - in reply to #11753) (#11754) Top
ashu Posts: 9	ashu posted @ 2013-07-15 11:46 PM prasanna16391 - 2013-07-15 11:40 PM ashu - 2013-07-15 11:29 PM okay...so we can say k ...its gonna be a bit similar to what comes in any...."easy"category sudoku...? and.......umm so there's no time limit thingy...we hv like 15 minutes...for one sudoku puzzle...thats it.....? You mean on my blog? My blog's easy category would probably be equivalent to one of the higher pointers in round 2 The best practice you can possibly get in this short time span is to go and solve Beginners' Sudoku Contest July. If you do that, you'll be well equipped for last year's 2nd round standards. Either the instructions are misleading here or they've changed the format from last year. Last year, we had 8 6x6 Sudokus to finish in the 15 minutes. I know 8's a lot more than 1, but 6x6s are pretty easy so if its the same it should be pretty finishable. hahahahahaha....okay okay...... :D hoping for the best :)) nice talking to you.. :)) thanx a tonne..
	@ 2013-07-15 11:47 PM (#11755 - in reply to #11754) (#11755) Top
ashu Posts: 9	ashu posted @ 2013-07-15 11:47 PM ashu - 2013-07-15 11:46 PM prasanna16391 - 2013-07-15 11:40 PM ashu - 2013-07-15 11:29 PM okay...so we can say k ...its gonna be a bit similar to what comes in any...."easy"category sudoku...? and.......umm so there's no time limit thingy...we hv like 15 minutes...for one sudoku puzzle...thats it.....? You mean on my blog? My blog's easy category would probably be equivalent to one of the higher pointers in round 2 The best practice you can possibly get in this short time span is to go and solve Beginners' Sudoku Contest July. If you do that, you'll be well equipped for last year's 2nd round standards. Either the instructions are misleading here or they've changed the format from last year. Last year, we had 8 6x6 Sudokus to finish in the 15 minutes. I know 8's a lot more than 1, but 6x6s are pretty easy so if its the same it should be pretty finishable. hahahahahaha....okay okay...... :D hoping for the best :)) nice talking to you.. :)) thanx a tonne.. achha haan... umm...the classic ones or the variants tooo :P
	@ 2013-07-15 11:56 PM (#11756 - in reply to #11755) (#11756) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-15 11:56 PM ashu - 2013-07-15 11:47 PM achha haan... umm...the classic ones or the variants tooo :P The variants too. Thats why I pointed specifically to the July edition. Same variants as last year.
	@ 2013-07-16 6:56 AM (#11757 - in reply to #11711) (#11757) Top
devarajand Posts: 114 Country : India	devarajand posted @ 2013-07-16 6:56 AM Is this competition is only for metro living people. Why there is no on line round.
	@ 2013-07-16 4:12 PM (#11776 - in reply to #11757) (#11776) Top
rakesh_rai Posts: 774 Country : India	rakesh_rai posted @ 2013-07-16 4:12 PM devarajand - 2013-07-16 6:56 AM Is this competition is only for metro living people. Why there is no online round. This year (like last year), it is happening in four metros only. If you want to participate you will need to travel to one of these cities on the given dates, as there is no online round this time.
	@ 2013-07-19 10:02 PM (#11815 - in reply to #11711) (#11815) Top
rvarun Posts: 268 Country : India	rvarun posted @ 2013-07-19 10:02 PM All the Best for the participants for this weekend's rounds in Chennai and Delhi. :)
	@ 2013-07-20 11:08 AM (#11817 - in reply to #11711) (#11817) Top
babuli Posts: 4 Country : India	babuli posted @ 2013-07-20 11:08 AM Do we have any info. about the types of sudoku for the regional rounds.
	@ 2013-07-20 5:21 PM (#11819 - in reply to #11817) (#11819) Top
rvarun Posts: 268 Country : India	rvarun posted @ 2013-07-20 5:21 PM A great Congrats chennai round winners.. 1. Rishi Puri 2. Ezhilarasi 3. Kishore kumar 3. Jaipal Reddy
	@ 2013-07-20 5:25 PM (#11820 - in reply to #11819) (#11820) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-20 5:25 PM Congrats to the 4 :) Hopefully I make it in Mumbai and finally get to meet and compete against Rishi in person. Also, good show by Kishore to out-score Jaipal. Congrats to the person at 2nd, not sure if its a newcomer or some member here who I'm forgetting. Either way, finishing ahead of Kishore and Jaipal is quite good.
	@ 2013-07-20 5:33 PM (#11822 - in reply to #11820) (#11822) Top
rakesh_rai Posts: 774 Country : India	rakesh_rai posted @ 2013-07-20 5:33 PM Kishore and Jaipal were joint third, submitting in 42 minutes. Ezhilarasi finished in 40 minutes. Rishi in 26 minutes.
	@ 2013-07-20 6:31 PM (#11823 - in reply to #11711) (#11823) Top
ssandy Posts: 5 Country : India	ssandy posted @ 2013-07-20 6:31 PM congrats to all the winners and a very good show overall too at chennai
	@ 2013-07-20 8:33 PM (#11824 - in reply to #11711) (#11824) Top
rajeshk Posts: 542 Country : India	rajeshk posted @ 2013-07-20 8:33 PM Congrats to all the winners of Chennai round. Best of luck to Delhi participants.
	@ 2013-07-20 10:31 PM (#11827 - in reply to #11824) (#11827) Top
ashu Posts: 9	ashu posted @ 2013-07-20 10:31 PM rajeshk - 2013-07-20 8:33 PM Congrats to all the winners of Chennai round. Best of luck to Delhi participants. can u plz help me with the typ of puzzles we'll be getting at delhi round.... mine is tomorrow...
	@ 2013-07-20 10:47 PM (#11829 - in reply to #11827) (#11829) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-20 10:47 PM ashu - 2013-07-20 10:31 PM can u plz help me with the typ of puzzles we'll be getting at delhi round.... mine is tomorrow... Well, having spoken to Chennai Round winner Rishi, the structure seems to be largely similar to last year's. The first round is 6x6s (last year had 8) to be solved in 15 minutes, and the second round seems to be the same 4 classic/4 variant structure as last year, with the only difference being that instead of two rounds of 30 minutes each, it is one round of 60 minutes (hence the timings of 40 and 42 for 2nd and 3rd places).
	@ 2013-07-20 11:55 PM (#11830 - in reply to #11711) (#11830) Top
shera90 Posts: 71 Country : India	shera90 posted @ 2013-07-20 11:55 PM The regional rounds I think are biased completely ignoring EAST ZONE focussing only on west and south zones of India. With such short notice, how can one living in eastern zone states like West Bengal, Bihar, Assam etc. plan their travel and stay. Edited by shera90 2013-07-20 11:57 PM
	@ 2013-07-21 12:08 AM (#11831 - in reply to #11711) (#11831) Top
ashu Posts: 9	ashu posted @ 2013-07-21 12:08 AM can we bring any number of sheets... :D :P
	@ 2013-07-21 12:17 AM (#11832 - in reply to #11711) (#11832) Top
ashu Posts: 9	ashu posted @ 2013-07-21 12:17 AM and prasanna....r u on fb... :D
	@ 2013-07-21 12:57 AM (#11833 - in reply to #11831) (#11833) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-07-21 12:57 AM ashu - 2013-07-21 12:08 AM can we bring any number of sheets... :D :P You mean rough work sheets? Yes of course, I think so. I'll wait for the organizers to confirm but I don't see how that helps gain any unfair advantage, since in the end you'll have to submit the booklet that's provided only.
	@ 2013-07-21 8:44 AM (#11834 - in reply to #11711) (#11834) Top
kishy72 Posts: 419 Country : India	kishy72 posted @ 2013-07-21 8:44 AM It was an enjoyable yesterday at the event for me and 2 of my other friends.Sudokus were of a very good quality and it was nice solving all of them.I also got to speak a little with some of the bigwigs in Indian sudoku who otherwise came out as very humble and soft spoken to me . Here's the article in Times of India,Chennai edition.They have made a mistake though(not the first time i think :)?!).I was joint third and not the second to complete . http://epaper.timesofindia.com/Default/Scripting/ArticleWin.asp?Fro... Edited by kishy72 2013-07-21 8:45 AM
	@ 2013-07-21 2:29 PM (#11836 - in reply to #11834) (#11836) Top
rvarun Posts: 268 Country : India	rvarun posted @ 2013-07-21 2:29 PM A great day with good organization. The puzzles were too good and it was nice to be part of the city finals one more time. Congrats Kishore and Ezhilarasi, the new faces from Chennai in National Round. :-) Nice to meet Rakesh, Rishi and Jaipal and interacting with them for first time was a nice experience. All the best to the participants of the Delhi round of TSC 2013. Edited by rvarun 2013-07-21 2:41 PM