Thread - LMI Screen Test #4 — November Sudoku Test

@ 2013-11-09 5:08 AM (#13373 - in reply to #13371) (#13373) Top

Joo M.Y

Posts: 72

Country : South Korea

Joo M.Y posted @ 2013-11-09 5:08 AM

Can you postpone this test 22nd-25th November?

Because HCS11 will be started 15th-18th November!!!
http://www.logic-masters.de/Wettbewerbe/wettbewerb.php?id=60

@ 2013-11-09 9:45 AM (#13376 - in reply to #13373) (#13376) Top

rajeshk

Posts: 542

Country : India

rajeshk posted @ 2013-11-09 9:45 AM

Yes, it will be great if this test can be postponed. Along with HCS11, we have Bangalore Brain Games at Bangalore

@ 2013-11-09 9:47 AM (#13377 - in reply to #13373) (#13377) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-09 9:47 AM

Joo M.Y - 2013-11-09 5:08 AM

Can you postpone this test 22nd-25th November?

Because HCS11 will be started 15th-18th November!!!
http://www.logic-masters.de/Wettbewerbe/wettbewerb.php?id=60

Sorry but no. We have our schedules decided in advance too, even though we release things just a week before. There's other contests to consider too. Also, this test is just 60 minutes, and we have had even tests of 120 minutes or more on the same weekend as other competitions. With the puzzle calendar as it is, its inevitable to have many overlaps. We try our best to avoid overlapping with National Championships and major offline events, but unfortunately sometimes that can happen too.

And Rajesh, the test is from Friday to Monday, and Brain Games is only during the weekend, and not a full day event. Plus I think its lovely to have a nice test to direct that audience to on Sunday

@ 2013-11-09 6:38 PM (#13379 - in reply to #13377) (#13379) Top

rajeshk

Posts: 542

Country : India

rajeshk posted @ 2013-11-09 6:38 PM

prasanna16391 - 2013-11-09 9:47 AM

And Rajesh, the test is from Friday to Monday, and Brain Games is only during the weekend, and not a full day event. Plus I think its lovely to have a nice test to direct that audience to on Sunday

Agree with you Prasanna. We can make audience at aware of LMI and direct them to this test.:)

Looking forward to this test.

@ 2013-11-12 6:18 PM (#13390 - in reply to #13379) (#13390) Top

Administrator

Country : India

Administrator posted @ 2013-11-12 6:18 PM

Logic Masters India announces November Sudoku Test — LMI Screen Test #4

Dates : 15^th — 18^th November

Length : Approximately 60 minutes

Details : here

Designer : Prasanna Seshadri

Note : Please read all instructions on Page 2 and Page 3 carefully. Especially Page 3. Also note that 5 Sudokus are Just One Cell Sudokus. The details of this are given in the instructions.

@ 2013-11-12 8:31 PM (#13391 - in reply to #13371) (#13391) Top

ka_bharath

Posts: 6

Country : India

ka_bharath posted @ 2013-11-12 8:31 PM

Hi Prasanna,

In the Information Booklet (PDF containing Example Sudokus), a couple of Sudokus on pages 5 and 6 (A11, A12, B1 and B2) are partially solved. Could you please complete them.

Thanks & Regards,
Bharath

@ 2013-11-12 8:37 PM (#13392 - in reply to #13391) (#13392) Top

ka_bharath

Posts: 6

Country : India

ka_bharath posted @ 2013-11-12 8:37 PM

Sorry, I did not realize that the Sudokus were “Just One Cell” Sudokus.

@ 2013-11-12 11:05 PM (#13398 - in reply to #13371) (#13398) Top

connect4

Posts: 7

Country : United States

connect4 posted @ 2013-11-12 11:05 PM

Just to check further, B9 appears to be an invalid puzzle in the instruction book (several cases of repeated digits in boxes, unless I missed something on that one).

@ 2013-11-12 11:39 PM (#13399 - in reply to #13398) (#13399) Top

Fred76

Posts: 337

Country : Switzerland

Fred76 posted @ 2013-11-12 11:39 PM

connect4 - 2013-11-12 11:05 PM

Just to check further, B9 appears to be an invalid puzzle in the instruction book (several cases of repeated digits in boxes, unless I missed something on that one).

The shape of regions should be 3X2 instead of 2X3.

@ 2013-11-13 12:26 AM (#13400 - in reply to #13399) (#13400) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-13 12:26 AM

Fred76 - 2013-11-12 11:39 PM

connect4 - 2013-11-12 11:05 PM

Just to check further, B9 appears to be an invalid puzzle in the instruction book (several cases of repeated digits in boxes, unless I missed something on that one).

The shape of regions should be 3X2 instead of 2X3.

Yup this is exactly whats happened. Sorry about the goof up. It will be fixed soon.

@ 2013-11-13 12:31 AM (#13401 - in reply to #13371) (#13401) Top

kishy72

Posts: 419

Country : India

kishy72 posted @ 2013-11-13 12:31 AM

no option to pencilmark ?!.....again?

@ 2013-11-13 12:57 AM (#13403 - in reply to #13401) (#13403) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-13 12:57 AM

kishy72 - 2013-11-13 12:31 AM

no option to pencilmark ?!.....again?

Check the Instruction booklet. There's a reasoning there. Screen Tests are designed to test visual skills. We've made an effort to make the difficulty easier this year, but I think its important to keep this a visual skill based test.

@ 2013-11-13 12:59 AM (#13404 - in reply to #13371) (#13404) Top

margareta456

Posts: 30

Country : Poland

margareta456 posted @ 2013-11-13 12:59 AM

I'm sorry, but can somebody explain me what does it mean 'converse rule applies'? I'm new there and not from englishspeaking country and I see such rule for the first. Thanks.

@ 2013-11-13 1:02 AM (#13405 - in reply to #13404) (#13405) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-13 1:02 AM

margareta456 - 2013-11-13 12:59 AM

I'm sorry, but can somebody explain me what does it mean 'converse rule applies'? I'm new there and not from englishspeaking country and I see such rule for the first. Thanks.

It basically means that, for the rule that says "if X is there, then Y should happen", you should also take into consideration "if X is not there, Y shouldn't happen". Take XV for example, if there is an X between 2 cells, then the sum of those cells must be 10. Because converse rule applies, if there isn't an X between 2 cells then the sum cannot be 10.

@ 2013-11-13 1:13 AM (#13406 - in reply to #13371) (#13406) Top

margareta456

Posts: 30

Country : Poland

margareta456 posted @ 2013-11-13 1:13 AM

thank you, I understand it thanks to your example :)

@ 2013-11-13 9:04 AM (#13408 - in reply to #13371) (#13408) Top

Yuhei Kusui

Posts: 42

Country : Japan

Yuhei Kusui posted @ 2013-11-13 9:04 AM

A question about scoring:
- Each sudoku is worth points varying from 25 to 200.
- The exact point will be computed after the test is completed as “average of 30 best times (in seconds) for that sudoku”, subject to the minimum and maximum values.
I’d like to know how the exact point will be adjusted from 25 to 200 if an average time is less than 25 seconds or over 200 seconds.

@ 2013-11-13 10:36 AM (#13409 - in reply to #13408) (#13409) Top

achan1058

Posts: 80

Country : Canada

achan1058 posted @ 2013-11-13 10:36 AM

I know this is a lot to ask, but is it possible to make the applet less sluggish in the future? Moving and typing feels very slow compared to Nikoli. Also, can you implement backspace as delete as well?

@ 2013-11-13 3:20 PM (#13410 - in reply to #13371) (#13410) Top

Realshaggy

Posts: 69

Country : Germany

Realshaggy posted @ 2013-11-13 3:20 PM

Does the 15 second waiting time before each puzzle (which you can skip according to the booklet) count for the total time?

@ 2013-11-13 8:12 PM (#13411 - in reply to #13371) (#13411) Top

chaotic_iak

Posts: 241

Country : Indonesia

chaotic_iak posted @ 2013-11-13 8:12 PM

For B2, does it mean that at least two of the squares adjacent to a shaded square contain the same number? It's not quite clear from the description; can anyone post a fully solved Repeated Neighbors Sudoku puzzle (obviously not the one in the IB)?

@ 2013-11-13 9:30 PM (#13412 - in reply to #13410) (#13412) Top

swaroop2011

Posts: 668

Country : India

swaroop2011 posted @ 2013-11-13 9:30 PM

Realshaggy - 2013-11-13 3:20 PM

Does the 15 second waiting time before each puzzle (which you can skip according to the booklet) count for the total time?

It does not count in your total time.

@ 2013-11-13 9:34 PM (#13413 - in reply to #13408) (#13413) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-13 9:34 PM

Yuhei Kusui - 2013-11-13 9:04 AM

A question about scoring:
- Each sudoku is worth points varying from 25 to 200.
- The exact point will be computed after the test is completed as “average of 30 best times (in seconds) for that sudoku”, subject to the minimum and maximum values.
I’d like to know how the exact point will be adjusted from 25 to 200 if an average time is less than 25 seconds or over 200 seconds.

Hey Yuhei,

25 and 200 are the minimum and maximum values. i.e. no Sudoku will be less than 25 or more than 200 points.

@ 2013-11-13 11:07 PM (#13415 - in reply to #13411) (#13415) Top

prasanna16391

Posts: 1801

Country : India

prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-13 11:07 PM

chaotic_iak - 2013-11-13 8:12 PM

For B2, does it mean that at least two of the squares adjacent to a shaded square contain the same number? It's not quite clear from the description; can anyone post a fully solved Repeated Neighbors Sudoku puzzle (obviously not the one in the IB)?

Yup thats what it means. But note the converse rule too. More than just solution, there's a way to look at an entire solve by going to the Sudokucup Guest League page and seeing others solve my Repeated Neighbours on 24th July

@ 2013-11-14 10:01 AM (#13418 - in reply to #13413) (#13418) Top

Yuhei Kusui

Posts: 42

Country : Japan

Yuhei Kusui posted @ 2013-11-14 10:01 AM

prasanna16391 - 2013-11-13 9:34 PM

Hey Yuhei,

25 and 200 are the minimum and maximum values. i.e. no Sudoku will be less than 25 or more than 200 points.

Ok, Thanks!

@ 2013-11-15 6:27 AM (#13433 - in reply to #13409) (#13433) Top

Administrator

Country : India

Administrator posted @ 2013-11-15 6:27 AM

achan1058 - 2013-11-13 10:36 AM

I know this is a lot to ask, but is it possible to make the applet less sluggish in the future? Moving and typing feels very slow compared to Nikoli. Also, can you implement backspace as delete as well?

Thanks for bringing it up. For future contests, we will have a close look at the user-interaction part to see what can be improved. I hope it is equally bad (or good) for everyone.

@ 2013-11-15 6:29 AM (#13434 - in reply to #13371) (#13434) Top

Administrator

Country : India

Administrator posted @ 2013-11-15 6:29 AM

Link to score page - http://logicmastersindia.com/ST/ST4/score.asp

Score page can be viewed after 60 minutes of `solving` time.
Please note that, like earlier Screen Tests, score page can be viewed only if you are logged on to this forum. (If you can't read the post below, you can't view the score page.)


	@ 2013-11-09 5:08 AM (#13373 - in reply to #13371) (#13373) Top
Joo M.Y Posts: 72 Country : South Korea	Joo M.Y posted @ 2013-11-09 5:08 AM Can you postpone this test 22nd-25th November? Because HCS11 will be started 15th-18th November!!! http://www.logic-masters.de/Wettbewerbe/wettbewerb.php?id=60
	@ 2013-11-09 9:45 AM (#13376 - in reply to #13373) (#13376) Top
rajeshk Posts: 542 Country : India	rajeshk posted @ 2013-11-09 9:45 AM Yes, it will be great if this test can be postponed. Along with HCS11, we have Bangalore Brain Games at Bangalore
	@ 2013-11-09 9:47 AM (#13377 - in reply to #13373) (#13377) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-09 9:47 AM Joo M.Y - 2013-11-09 5:08 AM Can you postpone this test 22nd-25th November? Because HCS11 will be started 15th-18th November!!! http://www.logic-masters.de/Wettbewerbe/wettbewerb.php?id=60 Sorry but no. We have our schedules decided in advance too, even though we release things just a week before. There's other contests to consider too. Also, this test is just 60 minutes, and we have had even tests of 120 minutes or more on the same weekend as other competitions. With the puzzle calendar as it is, its inevitable to have many overlaps. We try our best to avoid overlapping with National Championships and major offline events, but unfortunately sometimes that can happen too. And Rajesh, the test is from Friday to Monday, and Brain Games is only during the weekend, and not a full day event. Plus I think its lovely to have a nice test to direct that audience to on Sunday
	@ 2013-11-09 6:38 PM (#13379 - in reply to #13377) (#13379) Top
rajeshk Posts: 542 Country : India	rajeshk posted @ 2013-11-09 6:38 PM prasanna16391 - 2013-11-09 9:47 AM And Rajesh, the test is from Friday to Monday, and Brain Games is only during the weekend, and not a full day event. Plus I think its lovely to have a nice test to direct that audience to on Sunday Agree with you Prasanna. We can make audience at aware of LMI and direct them to this test.:) Looking forward to this test.
	@ 2013-11-12 6:18 PM (#13390 - in reply to #13379) (#13390) Top
Administrator Country : India	Administrator posted @ 2013-11-12 6:18 PM Logic Masters India announces November Sudoku Test — LMI Screen Test #4 Dates : 15^th — 18^th November Length : Approximately 60 minutes Details : here Designer : Prasanna Seshadri Note : Please read all instructions on Page 2 and Page 3 carefully. Especially Page 3. Also note that 5 Sudokus are Just One Cell Sudokus. The details of this are given in the instructions.
	@ 2013-11-12 8:31 PM (#13391 - in reply to #13371) (#13391) Top
ka_bharath Posts: 6 Country : India	ka_bharath posted @ 2013-11-12 8:31 PM Hi Prasanna, In the Information Booklet (PDF containing Example Sudokus), a couple of Sudokus on pages 5 and 6 (A11, A12, B1 and B2) are partially solved. Could you please complete them. Thanks & Regards, Bharath
	@ 2013-11-12 8:37 PM (#13392 - in reply to #13391) (#13392) Top
ka_bharath Posts: 6 Country : India	ka_bharath posted @ 2013-11-12 8:37 PM Sorry, I did not realize that the Sudokus were “Just One Cell” Sudokus.
	@ 2013-11-12 11:05 PM (#13398 - in reply to #13371) (#13398) Top
connect4 Posts: 7 Country : United States	connect4 posted @ 2013-11-12 11:05 PM Just to check further, B9 appears to be an invalid puzzle in the instruction book (several cases of repeated digits in boxes, unless I missed something on that one).
	@ 2013-11-12 11:39 PM (#13399 - in reply to #13398) (#13399) Top
Fred76 Posts: 337 Country : Switzerland	Fred76 posted @ 2013-11-12 11:39 PM connect4 - 2013-11-12 11:05 PM Just to check further, B9 appears to be an invalid puzzle in the instruction book (several cases of repeated digits in boxes, unless I missed something on that one). The shape of regions should be 3X2 instead of 2X3.
	@ 2013-11-13 12:26 AM (#13400 - in reply to #13399) (#13400) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-13 12:26 AM Fred76 - 2013-11-12 11:39 PM connect4 - 2013-11-12 11:05 PM Just to check further, B9 appears to be an invalid puzzle in the instruction book (several cases of repeated digits in boxes, unless I missed something on that one). The shape of regions should be 3X2 instead of 2X3. Yup this is exactly whats happened. Sorry about the goof up. It will be fixed soon.
	@ 2013-11-13 12:31 AM (#13401 - in reply to #13371) (#13401) Top
kishy72 Posts: 419 Country : India	kishy72 posted @ 2013-11-13 12:31 AM no option to pencilmark ?!.....again?
	@ 2013-11-13 12:57 AM (#13403 - in reply to #13401) (#13403) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-13 12:57 AM kishy72 - 2013-11-13 12:31 AM no option to pencilmark ?!.....again? Check the Instruction booklet. There's a reasoning there. Screen Tests are designed to test visual skills. We've made an effort to make the difficulty easier this year, but I think its important to keep this a visual skill based test.
	@ 2013-11-13 12:59 AM (#13404 - in reply to #13371) (#13404) Top
margareta456 Posts: 30 Country : Poland	margareta456 posted @ 2013-11-13 12:59 AM I'm sorry, but can somebody explain me what does it mean 'converse rule applies'? I'm new there and not from englishspeaking country and I see such rule for the first. Thanks.
	@ 2013-11-13 1:02 AM (#13405 - in reply to #13404) (#13405) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-13 1:02 AM margareta456 - 2013-11-13 12:59 AM I'm sorry, but can somebody explain me what does it mean 'converse rule applies'? I'm new there and not from englishspeaking country and I see such rule for the first. Thanks. It basically means that, for the rule that says "if X is there, then Y should happen", you should also take into consideration "if X is not there, Y shouldn't happen". Take XV for example, if there is an X between 2 cells, then the sum of those cells must be 10. Because converse rule applies, if there isn't an X between 2 cells then the sum cannot be 10.
	@ 2013-11-13 1:13 AM (#13406 - in reply to #13371) (#13406) Top
margareta456 Posts: 30 Country : Poland	margareta456 posted @ 2013-11-13 1:13 AM thank you, I understand it thanks to your example :)
	@ 2013-11-13 9:04 AM (#13408 - in reply to #13371) (#13408) Top
Yuhei Kusui Posts: 42 Country : Japan	Yuhei Kusui posted @ 2013-11-13 9:04 AM A question about scoring: - Each sudoku is worth points varying from 25 to 200. - The exact point will be computed after the test is completed as “average of 30 best times (in seconds) for that sudoku”, subject to the minimum and maximum values. I’d like to know how the exact point will be adjusted from 25 to 200 if an average time is less than 25 seconds or over 200 seconds.
	@ 2013-11-13 10:36 AM (#13409 - in reply to #13408) (#13409) Top
achan1058 Posts: 80 Country : Canada	achan1058 posted @ 2013-11-13 10:36 AM I know this is a lot to ask, but is it possible to make the applet less sluggish in the future? Moving and typing feels very slow compared to Nikoli. Also, can you implement backspace as delete as well?
	@ 2013-11-13 3:20 PM (#13410 - in reply to #13371) (#13410) Top
Realshaggy Posts: 69 Country : Germany	Realshaggy posted @ 2013-11-13 3:20 PM Does the 15 second waiting time before each puzzle (which you can skip according to the booklet) count for the total time?
	@ 2013-11-13 8:12 PM (#13411 - in reply to #13371) (#13411) Top
chaotic_iak Posts: 241 Country : Indonesia	chaotic_iak posted @ 2013-11-13 8:12 PM For B2, does it mean that at least two of the squares adjacent to a shaded square contain the same number? It's not quite clear from the description; can anyone post a fully solved Repeated Neighbors Sudoku puzzle (obviously not the one in the IB)?
	@ 2013-11-13 9:30 PM (#13412 - in reply to #13410) (#13412) Top
swaroop2011 Posts: 668 Country : India	swaroop2011 posted @ 2013-11-13 9:30 PM Realshaggy - 2013-11-13 3:20 PM Does the 15 second waiting time before each puzzle (which you can skip according to the booklet) count for the total time? It does not count in your total time.
	@ 2013-11-13 9:34 PM (#13413 - in reply to #13408) (#13413) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-13 9:34 PM Yuhei Kusui - 2013-11-13 9:04 AM A question about scoring: - Each sudoku is worth points varying from 25 to 200. - The exact point will be computed after the test is completed as “average of 30 best times (in seconds) for that sudoku”, subject to the minimum and maximum values. I’d like to know how the exact point will be adjusted from 25 to 200 if an average time is less than 25 seconds or over 200 seconds. Hey Yuhei, 25 and 200 are the minimum and maximum values. i.e. no Sudoku will be less than 25 or more than 200 points.
	@ 2013-11-13 11:07 PM (#13415 - in reply to #13411) (#13415) Top
prasanna16391 Posts: 1801 Country : India	prasanna16391 posted @ 2013-11-13 11:07 PM chaotic_iak - 2013-11-13 8:12 PM For B2, does it mean that at least two of the squares adjacent to a shaded square contain the same number? It's not quite clear from the description; can anyone post a fully solved Repeated Neighbors Sudoku puzzle (obviously not the one in the IB)? Yup thats what it means. But note the converse rule too. More than just solution, there's a way to look at an entire solve by going to the Sudokucup Guest League page and seeing others solve my Repeated Neighbours on 24th July
	@ 2013-11-14 10:01 AM (#13418 - in reply to #13413) (#13418) Top
Yuhei Kusui Posts: 42 Country : Japan	Yuhei Kusui posted @ 2013-11-14 10:01 AM prasanna16391 - 2013-11-13 9:34 PM Yuhei Kusui - 2013-11-13 9:04 AM A question about scoring: - Each sudoku is worth points varying from 25 to 200. - The exact point will be computed after the test is completed as “average of 30 best times (in seconds) for that sudoku”, subject to the minimum and maximum values. I’d like to know how the exact point will be adjusted from 25 to 200 if an average time is less than 25 seconds or over 200 seconds. Hey Yuhei, 25 and 200 are the minimum and maximum values. i.e. no Sudoku will be less than 25 or more than 200 points. Ok, Thanks!
	@ 2013-11-15 6:27 AM (#13433 - in reply to #13409) (#13433) Top
Administrator Country : India	Administrator posted @ 2013-11-15 6:27 AM achan1058 - 2013-11-13 10:36 AM I know this is a lot to ask, but is it possible to make the applet less sluggish in the future? Moving and typing feels very slow compared to Nikoli. Also, can you implement backspace as delete as well? Thanks for bringing it up. For future contests, we will have a close look at the user-interaction part to see what can be improved. I hope it is equally bad (or good) for everyone.
	@ 2013-11-15 6:29 AM (#13434 - in reply to #13371) (#13434) Top
Administrator Country : India	Administrator posted @ 2013-11-15 6:29 AM Link to score page - http://logicmastersindia.com/ST/ST4/score.asp Score page can be viewed after 60 minutes of `solving` time. Please note that, like earlier Screen Tests, score page can be viewed only if you are logged on to this forum. (If you can't read the post below, you can't view the score page.)