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Country : India | |
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-13 12:18 PM A few questions and comments. most are just related to me making the practise puzzles to make sure the puzzles are as representative of the actual puzzles.
Puzzle unrelated comment. The discussion thread link on the TVC XI page leads to the TVC X discussion thread.
Irregular Tapa:
1) The rules don't match the puzzle. It says that each shape is counted as one cell, except around the 3 clue are only 2 seperate shapess coloured. There are 3 cells coloured as one shape is 2 cells. So either the rules are incorrect or the example. The example currently doesn't match the way the variant appeared in the TVC before.
2) Can clues appear in irregular shapes?
Fractional Tapa:
Can clues appear in smaller squares?
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yureklis
Posts: 183
Country : Turkey | Para - 2012-03-13 12:18 PM
A few questions and comments. most are just related to me making the practise puzzles to make sure the puzzles are as representative of the actual puzzles.
Puzzle unrelated comment. The discussion thread link on the TVC XI page leads to the TVC X discussion thread.
Irregular Tapa:
1) The rules don't match the puzzle. It says that each shape is counted as one cell, except around the 3 clue are only 2 seperate shapess coloured. There are 3 cells coloured as one shape is 2 cells. So either the rules are incorrect or the example. The example currently doesn't match the way the variant appeared in the TVC before.
2) Can clues appear in irregular shapes?
Fractional Tapa:
Can clues appear in smaller squares?
1 ) Yes, you are right about it. I'll change example of it as considering original Irregular Tapa rule.
2 ) Yes, it can
-3 ) Yes, it can |
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Administrator
Country : India | Para - 2012-03-13 12:18 PM
Puzzle unrelated comment. The discussion thread link on the TVC XI page leads to the TVC X discussion thread.
Fixed. |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2012-03-14 2:27 AM I like meiosis and visionary.Fractional looks somewhat insane at first look.Some maths to be done there. |
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kiwijam
Posts: 182
Country : New Zealand | kiwijam posted @ 2012-03-14 6:54 AM I like the new square sizes for Fractional. Mad Max and Full scare me... |
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yureklis
Posts: 183
Country : Turkey | * Digitail Tapa: "There cannot be a zero in a multi-number clue cell." not true as you seen in the example. This sentence should be " There may be one zero or more zeros in a multi-number clue cell. |
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mucha
Posts: 13
Country : Poland | mucha posted @ 2012-03-14 3:20 PM In the power of tapa, the 2 1 2 clue doesn't seem to be correct. |
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yureklis
Posts: 183
Country : Turkey | mucha - 2012-03-14 3:20 PM
In the power of tapa, the 2 1 2 clue doesn't seem to be correct.
2^1^2 clue may be 2 or 212. I think there is not a problem in the example. |
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yureklis
Posts: 183
Country : Turkey | Para - 2012-03-13 12:18 PM
Irregular Tapa:
1) The rules don't match the puzzle. It says that each shape is counted as one cell, except around the 3 clue are only 2 seperate shapess coloured. There are 3 cells coloured as one shape is 2 cells. So either the rules are incorrect or the example. The example currently doesn't match the way the variant appeared in the TVC before.
When I first replied to this problem, I couldn't remember why I made the puzzle that way, so I said there was a problem. But when I attempted for a fix I remembered that: I made the puzzle that way because large cells counting as one cell could be confusing for neighbouring boxes' types. So I counted them as multiple cells. But we accidentally used the actual puzzle's instruction. So this puzzle type is not Irregular, maybe it can be Ir-irregular, thus making it a regular Tapa with different cells. |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2012-03-14 7:46 PM Meiosis: There is a possibility of single digit(even) clues breaking down to a single digit again(even or odd). Is that allowed? This will let two-digit clues breaking down to 2-digit clues again.the example does not show such behaviour. |
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yureklis
Posts: 183
Country : Turkey | anurag - 2012-03-14 7:46 PM
Meiosis: There is a possibility of single digit(even) clues breaking down to a single digit again(even or odd). Is that allowed? This will let two-digit clues breaking down to 2-digit clues again.the example does not show such behaviour.
As I understand correctly, you are asking this: If there is "2" in a cell, can it be only "1" after division, instead of "1-1"? The answer is no. Division here is not mathematical division, it is biological cell division, so something splits into two and both elements should be there. |
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prasanna16391
Posts: 1775
Country : India | yureklis - 2012-03-14 9:08 PM
As I understand correctly, you are asking this: If there is "2" in a cell, can it be only "1" after division, instead of "1-1"? The answer is no. Division here is not mathematical division, it is biological cell division, so something splits into two and both elements should be there.
Now I'm well and truly confused  .
If a "2" splits into "1-1", shouldn't a "1" split into "0.5-0.5" i.e. "0-5-0-5"? According to the way "1" is divided only into "0-5", "2" should be divided only into "1" I suppose. |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2012-03-14 11:11 PM alright, thats clear now.However,the practice puzzle i made follows my earlier understanding of splitting an even number into a single half.An even digit splitting into 2 parts might feel something like math tapa with the + operator.
looks like Tapa is slowly transforming into applied tapa.Reproduction,cell division. Physics is next i think(i have one variation on that theme).
Edited by anurag 2012-03-14 11:14 PM
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MellowMelon
Country : United States | I'm sorry, I'm still not clear on Meiosis Tapa. As I understand things now,
-- a 1 can either be used as a 1 or substituted for 0 5 (aka just 5)
-- a 2 can either be used as a 2 or substituted for 1 1
-- a 3 can either be used as a 3 or substituted for 1 5
-- a 4 can either be used as a 4 or substituted for 2 2
etc.
Is this correct? Also, can a clue divide twice? (4 becoming 2 1 1 for example)
Also, for Balance Tapa, for a puzzle of the size in the IB, is it only saying that the total number of black squares in columns 1,2,3 is the same as the total number of black squares in columns 5,6,7?
Edited by MellowMelon 2012-03-15 12:09 AM
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-15 12:22 AM yureklis - 2012-03-14 5:30 PM
Para - 2012-03-13 12:18 PM
Irregular Tapa:
1) The rules don't match the puzzle. It says that each shape is counted as one cell, except around the 3 clue are only 2 seperate shapess coloured. There are 3 cells coloured as one shape is 2 cells. So either the rules are incorrect or the example. The example currently doesn't match the way the variant appeared in the TVC before.
When I first replied to this problem, I couldn't remember why I made the puzzle that way, so I said there was a problem. But when I attempted for a fix I remembered that: I made the puzzle that way because large cells counting as one cell could be confusing for neighbouring boxes' types. So I counted them as multiple cells. But we accidentally used the actual puzzle's instruction. So this puzzle type is not Irregular, maybe it can be Ir-irregular, thus making it a regular Tapa with different cells.
But I just finished the Combined Tapa that way........
I figured it would just work the same for any edge clue. Although I didn't have any clues bordering the irregular tapa part.
I'll wait with the meiosis when it's completely confirmed. Edited by Para 2012-03-15 12:28 AM
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suboree
Posts: 9
Country : Turkey | suboree posted @ 2012-03-15 12:42 AM prasanna16391 - 2012-03-14 9:45 PM
yureklis - 2012-03-14 9:08 PM
As I understand correctly, you are asking this: If there is "2" in a cell, can it be only "1" after division, instead of "1-1"? The answer is no. Division here is not mathematical division, it is biological cell division, so something splits into two and both elements should be there.
Now I'm well and truly confused .
If a "2" splits into "1-1", shouldn't a "1" split into "0.5-0.5" i.e. "0-5-0-5"? According to the way "1" is divided only into "0-5", "2" should be divided only into "1" I suppose.
Dear puzzlers, Gulce speaking. Serkan is so busy nowadays and I was the one to write the comment of Serkan above, didn't notice I was logged in with his account : ) There is indeed a confusion with the rules, we have to set a constraint. Current example allows 2 becoming 1. Now I talked to him, he'll fix the rules when he gets back home. Sorry for causing trouble 
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-15 12:55 AM |
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-15 1:09 AM There is indeed a confusion with the rules, we have to set a constraint. Current example allows 2 becoming 1. Now I talked to him, he'll fix the rules when he gets back home. Sorry for causing trouble
No worry. No real hurry for it. As long as it gets resolved. Edited by Para 2012-03-15 2:25 AM
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Yokipi
Posts: 5
Country : United States | Yokipi posted @ 2012-03-15 4:36 AM Is relative order preserved in the Visionary Tapa clues? e.g. Is a 1234 different from a 1324? |
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yureklis
Posts: 183
Country : Turkey | Yokipi - 2012-03-15 4:36 AM
Is relative order preserved in the Visionary Tapa clues? e.g. Is a 1234 different from a 1324?
Order of the digits is not important, 1234 and 1324 are the same. |
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yureklis
Posts: 183
Country : Turkey | Corrections on the instructions are stated below. Meiosis Tapa will have a new example puzzle, edited version of the IB will be posted soon.
1. Combined Tapa:
Digital Tapa: Any digit has the possibility of being zero.
Ir-irregular Tapa: Each irregular shape counts as many cells as the unit squares it contains.
10. Meiosis Tapa:
Some of the given clue digits may be divided in half. This may happen in two different ways: Digit splits into two and creates two identical digits; or digit is only divided by two and results in a single number. Multi-digit clue cells may have divided and undivided digits together. If a digit divides in half and results in a decimal, each digit in the result counts as a new Tapa clue (e.g. if the original clue is 3, it becomes 1-5 after the division). Resulting digit of a division cannot be divided again. |
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-15 5:40 AM yureklis - 2012-03-15 5:20 AM
10. Meiosis Tapa:
Some of the given clue digits may be divided in half. This may happen in two different ways: Digit splits into two and creates two identical digits; or digit is only divided by two and results in a single number. Multi-digit clue cells may have divided and undivided digits together. If a digit divides in half and results in a decimal, each digit in the result counts as a new Tapa clue (e.g. if the original clue is 3, it becomes 1-5 after the division). Resulting digit of a division cannot be divided again.
So if I get it right a 22 clue can be a either of the following:
22 (no division )
21 (one divided by two )
211 (one divided in two )
11 (two divided by two )
111 (one divided by two, one divided in two )
1111 (two divided in two )
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Administrator
Country : India | yureklis - 2012-03-15 5:20 AM
Corrections on the instructions are stated below. Meiosis Tapa will have a new example puzzle, edited version of the IB will be posted soon.
Edited version of the IB is uploaded. |
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yureklis
Posts: 183
Country : Turkey | Para - 2012-03-15 5:40 AM
So if I get it right a 22 clue can be a either of the following:
22 (no division)
21 (one divided by two)
211 (one divided in two)
11 (two divided by two)
111 (one divided by two, one divided in two)
1111 (two divided in two)
Yes, all cases are possible. |
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2012-03-15 11:51 AM Sorry,this is a bit ridiculous,in my opinion.Having so many possibilities for a clue may only increase confusion.Its hard to figure out possibilities from the large mappings during the test.I believe it should be as simple as possible. |
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-15 11:54 PM Maybe there should be a small clarification to the ir-iregular Tapa rules. Currently it reads that each shape counts as as many cells it contains. But that's not exactly correct as it could be interpretted that a 3 cell area which touch the Tapa clue with 1 cell is counted as 3 cells, even though it's only meant to be counted as 1 cell.
It's supposed to mean each cell in a shape counts towards a tapa clue if it's touching the clue.
On a side note. Can anyone explain how to approach the Full Tapa example? I don't see a way to get started. |
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-16 12:13 AM |
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-16 11:09 AM How exactly does the answer key work for Fractional cells? If you look at row 4 or row 7 for example,it can get a bit confusing.
For row 7 is it
1,2,4 (count all squares that are touching as 1 )
1,2,3 (the bottom of the fractional cell only )
1,2,1,1 (the top of the fractional cells only )
1,2,2.75 (all cells touching, but fractional cells counted as fractions like in the clues )
For row 4 it's even so that the fractioned cell has two seperate pathways running off the same cell.
Deb edited to add the solution image.Edited by Para 2012-03-16 12:13 PM
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2012-03-16 5:47 PM If R6C6 is used by a vertical word,it can be One ,zero,two,six or four.One,two,six fail as it leaves a white space of 2 cells in the top-right corner.Four or zero leave R6C3-4 white,so they fail too.that leaves r6C6 with a horizontal word,which is atleast 4 long to satisfy the black block in the last row.A 4-letter word would leave a V-shaped 5 which leaves a white space in R5 that cant be filled.So only three can use the 6th row.This completes 6 and the entire right half.R1C6 must be black.Done!
Edited by anurag 2012-03-16 5:52 PM
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anurag
Posts: 136
Country : India | anurag posted @ 2012-03-16 5:50 PM Correct, the rules are badly written |
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Administrator
Country : India | | | AnnouncementsPassword protected pdf is uploaded. It has 10 pages (including a cover page)
Time bonus will be computed after you click "Claim Bonus"
Penalty will be given irrespective of correctness of submission
Contest Length : 75 minutes
Total Points : 1051
Bonus : 10 points per minute saved
Grace Period : 5 minutes
Penalty : 8 points per minute used (Computed upto seconds)
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-16 11:54 PM |
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-17 6:35 AM Para - 2012-03-16 11:09 AM
How exactly does the answer key work for Fractional cells? If you look at row 4 or row 7 for example,it can get a bit confusing.
For row 7 is it
1,2,4 (count all squares that are touching as 1 )
1,2,3 (the bottom of the fractional cell only )
1,2,1,1 (the top of the fractional cells only )
1,2,2.75 (all cells touching, but fractional cells counted as fractions like in the clues )
For row 4 it's even so that the fractioned cell has two seperate pathways running off the same cell.
Deb edited to add the solution image.
Can this question be answered, please? It seems kinda important for the test to know how the answer key works for this particular type. If it's irrelevant because no fractional cells will be in the answer rows and columns that would also help to know. Edited by Para 2012-03-17 6:37 AM
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MellowMelon
Country : United States | Para: The test's puzzle did not mark rows or columns with a divided cell, so it's fine. (edit: ok'd to say this by Deb in an email)
Thanks for the great test. As my post in this topic suggested and as my comment on motris's blog made more explicit, I was really worried about the set of variations here, but the test turned out to be the load of fun a TVC usually is. Happy with how I did, but taking it so early means it's a long wait to see how I compare with others...
Edited by MellowMelon 2012-03-17 7:52 AM
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swaroop2011
Posts: 668
Country : India | Hey it was a wonderful test , after series of screwed performances.
I liked combined tapa and visionary tapa the most.
Thanks for this wonderfull puzzles to LMI and authors.
Initially i was even not able to understand rules of the puzzles, but thanks to Prasanna for clearing doubts and also to Para for practice puzzles..
:) :) |
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prasanna16391
Posts: 1775
Country : India | swaroop2011 - 2012-03-17 4:44 PM
Hey it was a wonderful test , after series of screwed performances.
I liked combined tapa and visionary tapa the most.
Thanks for this wonderfull puzzles to LMI and authors.
Initially i was even not able to understand rules of the puzzles, but thanks to Prasanna for clearing doubts and also to Para for practice puzzles..
:) :)
You're welcome.
Well done on the test. Its my turn to have a series of messed up performances now. Hopefully that ends in TVC XII but I guess this puts me back quite a bit. :\ Ah well. |
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Calavera
Posts: 13
Country : Germany | I'm still uncertain about the Ir-irregular Tapa. Especially as the unofficial test puzzle by Para seems to follow different rules!?
Is the following correct: I blacken some areas. Each area has to be either completely black or completely white. When checking the clues and the 2x2-condition the blackened areas are treated as separate black squares.
Regards,
Calavera |
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prasanna16391
Posts: 1775
Country : India | Calavera - 2012-03-18 1:39 AM
I'm still uncertain about the Ir-irregular Tapa. Especially as the unofficial test puzzle by Para seems to follow different rules!?
Is the following correct: I blacken some areas. Each area has to be either completely black or completely white. When checking the clues and the 2x2-condition the blackened areas are treated as separate black squares.
Regards,
Calavera
Yes, thats right. A 2x1 area for example shall be counted as two cells for clue-counting purposes and a L-shaped Trimino that gets shaded means that 3 cells out of a 2x2 region are shaded. Hope that clears it up. |
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vopani
Posts: 739
Country : India | vopani posted @ 2012-03-18 10:35 AM A beautiful set of puzzles again... Thanks Serkan, you really have the skill of transforming any Tapa variant into a fantastic puzzle grid. |
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mucha
Posts: 13
Country : Poland | mucha posted @ 2012-03-18 9:34 PM Very enjoyable puzzles, thanks Serkan! |
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tamz29
Posts: 225
Country : Thailand | tamz29 posted @ 2012-03-19 8:37 PM Beautiful puzzles. Wasn't excited when the IB came out but these puzzles were fantastic. |
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Administrator
Country : India | Congratulations again to MellowMelon for winning TVC XI by a huge margin.
xevs and deu take 2nd and 3rd position respectively.
EKBM also played really well, but had a mistake in one puzzle.
Out of 126 players, 109 players got non-zero scores.
The table on the right shows cumulative normalized scores of top 10 players. | | |
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debmohanty
Country : India | With Serkan not around, I'll put some remarks like he does every time.
There were lot of discomfort among players when the IB was released, must be because of so many new types and some unfamiliar rules. MellowMelon was one of the first players to participate, he had a great performance, but he also posted in forum immediately that the puzzles were nice. Thanks and congratulations for yet another superb performance.
- The puzzle solved by least competitors was Power of Tapa. It was solved by 20 competitors.
- The puzzle solved by most competitors was Fractional Tapa. It was solved by 96 competitors.
- The puzzle with the highest rating was Visionary Tapa (9.28 ) and the puzzle with the lowest rating was Mad Max Tapa (Top ) (6.16 ).
- The puzzle submitted with the highest accuracy was Dissected Tapa (100% ), 64 competitors ), lowest was Mad Max Tapa (Bottom ) (48.89%, 22/45 competitors )
Here is the link to Cumulative results table - http://logicmastersindia.com/TVC/2012.asp
See you all in the next and final round.
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MellowMelon
Country : United States | So as I said a few days ago, the test did turn out to be really great. One suggestion I have that would scare everyone less is to not complicate the IB more than it needs to be. Specifically, say up front that the test's Meiosis Tapa would have only even numbers and no multi-number clues. I guess it's possible the IB was released before the puzzle was ready and/or finalized, but that variation as it was in the IB was just plain unwieldy. It's intimidating as hell to have a clue like 1 2 that can function as 1 2, 1 1 1, 1 1, or 1 5 (this possibility eliminates a lot of connectivity logic the clue might have otherwise). The test puzzle itself was great though.
Still not a fan of Mad Max. One good thing about logic puzzles like these is that as hard as solving them can be, checking them is usually easy and straightforward. But for a type like Mad Max, it's almost impossible to be totally sure you have the right answer; computationally, verifying a solution is as hard as solving the puzzle. I think the low success rate on that second puzzle is both not surprising and not a good thing. |
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Richard
Posts: 191
Country : The Netherlands | Richard posted @ 2012-03-20 12:03 PM I wasn't really enthusiastic at first when I saw the IB, but found enough interesting variants to fill my 75+ minutes after taking a closer look to all the puzzles.
Unfortunately I spent a lot of time on the meiosis tapa, running into contradictions at the same place all the time. I thought to have understand the rules properly, but obviously it's not. So I am very much interested in the solution. If someone can post it here in the forum I would be happy.
Because of the time spent on the meiosis, I just missed the Visionary tapa by a minute.  It was a wonderful puzzle, with a brilliant start. Thanks Serkan! |
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macherlakumar
Posts: 123
Country : India | Richard - 2012-03-20 12:03 PMI wasn't really enthusiastic at first when I saw the IB, but found enough interesting variants to fill my 75+ minutes after taking a closer look to all the puzzles.Unfortunately I spent a lot of time on the meiosis tapa, running into contradictions at the same place all the time. I thought to have understand the rules properly, but obviously it's not. So I am very much interested in the solution. If someone can post it here in the forum I would be happy.Because of the time spent on the meiosis, I just missed the Visionary tapa by a minute. It was a wonderful puzzle, with a brilliant start. Thanks Serkan! Hi, Even I have confused myself during the test, but this is a simple puzzle, after the test it took around 8 minutes for me. I hope the solution is correct. Regards, Ravi  (Meiosis Tapa.PNG)Attachments ----------------  Meiosis Tapa.PNG (13KB - 0 downloads) |
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Richard
Posts: 191
Country : The Netherlands | Richard posted @ 2012-03-20 12:26 PM Thanks!
My problem was the 6 in the middle. If you divide 6 by 2 yo get 3, not 3/3. So I assumed I did something wrong but didn't know what.
As far as I can see, the IB doesn't contain an example where an even digit gives a two-clue digit after dividing.
Did anyone else have problems with this or is it just me who can't read? |
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macherlakumar
Posts: 123
Country : India | Richard - 2012-03-20 12:26 PMThanks!My problem was the 6 in the middle. If you divide 6 by 2 yo get 3, not 3/3. So I assumed I did something wrong but didn't know what.As far as I can see, the IB doesn't contain an example where an even digit gives a two-clue digit after dividing.Did anyone else have problems with this or is it just me who can't read? Hi, Para has explained by taking 2 2 as an example in this thread, probably you might have missed it. http://logicmastersindia.com/forum/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=458&start=23 Regards, Ravi |
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flk
Posts: 23
Country : Australia | flk posted @ 2012-03-20 1:01 PM Thanks again for the many fun puzzles, Serkan! |
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-20 1:20 PM I'd be interested in seeing the solution to the Mad Max Tapa. I wasn't confident in my solution being optimal and didn't want to risk losing points submitting after the 75 minutes expired (even though it was only 5 seconds), which is why I only submitted for 10 puzzles and not 11. If there's some logic involved in confirming the maximum that would also be nice to know. I was hoping for some kind of logic that I had in mine, but I couldn't really find any. |
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rob
Posts: 170
Country : Germany | rob posted @ 2012-03-20 3:48 PM I just solved this one after the fact. There was far more pure Tapa solving to do than I could see during the contest… The picture I intend to attach shows how far I could get just with Tapa deductions. At that point, you can shade in all cells that don't neighbour clues and complete this to a solution that also maximizes the clued cells (around the 6,3,23,11 chain ).
 (madmax.png)Attachments ---------------- madmax.png (19KB - 3 downloads) |
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forcolin
Posts: 172
Country : ITALY | I also solved it in the aftermath. The factor which makes the solution unique is column 1.
You have to connect the upper part with the bottom part. You can't do it on the right hand side because of the pait (11). If you do it in column 1 if you blacken R7 and R8 you lose the opportunity to blacken R10 and R11.
If you blacken R7, R10 and R11 you blacken 3 cells insted of 2, and you can still connect top and bottom through R8C7 and R6C10, and this also gives a unique solution for the (11) pair in R3C11 |
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MellowMelon
Country : United States | For Mad Max, I did not get as much in the top as rob has in that image, but I had the rest. When I was stuck there I decided I would try to shade in all the unclued squares, save for the top left where at least one had to be left white, and see if that worked. Wasn't 100% sure though when I was done, since it could have been possible to squeeze out more by leaving more squares at the intersections of clues unshaded. I eventually convinced myself that there was no way a puzzle in a timed contest could be that cruel to have the valid and fairly well-constrained solution I had found and not have it be right, but it was a doubt I had even as I went to claim time bonus...
By the way rob, why didn't you shade R10C6 and R10C11? =P |
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swaroop2011
Posts: 668
Country : India | where can i see the cumulative scores of all 3 tapas held till now. |
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Para
Posts: 315
Country : The Netherlands | Para posted @ 2012-03-21 12:48 AM Thanks rob, I hadn't noticed the Tapa bit was that much constrained. I was expecting more of maximise coloured unclued cells vs minimise double clued cells. But it seems the optimise bit was much smaller in this puzzle.
swaroop2011 - 2012-03-20 8:19 PM
where can i see the cumulative scores of all 3 tapas held till now.
http://logicmastersindia.com/TVC/2012.asp |
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rob
Posts: 170
Country : Germany | rob posted @ 2012-03-21 2:33 PM By the way rob, why didn't you shade R10C6 and R10C11? =P
Yes, I really should have that pattern down by now.
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