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Administrator
   
Country : India | Logic Masters India announces September Sudoku Test - Sudoku Hot Pot
Date - 25th and 26th
Sudoku Types - Classics and many Variants
Length - 120 minutes
IB and Submission Link : http://logicmastersindia.com/M201009S |
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-15 12:26 AM It looks to be a great set of puzzles !
it is unfortunate that there are no real examples in the IB, just solutions (except for "incomplete killer" ).
However I take part to Chen Cen Cup III and grids were very nice (there were grids from Chen Cen and Ce Jin ). So I think this will be a very fun tournament !
Here is an example for "Greater sudoku" (solution is in the IB ): http://photo.blog.sina.com.cn/list/blogpic.php?pid=602619f0t8ccd438... (that is a grid appearing in Chen Cen Cup III ).
You can find a "Bush Sudoku" on my blog (I named it NoX ): http://sudokuvariante.blogspot.com/2010/08/nox-n1.htmlEdited by Fred76 2010-09-15 12:30 AM
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detuned
Posts: 152
Country : United Kingdom | detuned posted @ 2010-09-15 4:26 AM |
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debmohanty
Country : India | thanks for the link guys - for the example puzzles.
Fred, do you have a link for all puzzles in Chen Cen Cup? |
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-15 5:02 AM debmohanty - 2010-09-15 4:37 AM
thanks for the link guys - for the example puzzles.
Fred, do you have a link for all puzzles in Chen Cen Cup?
Yes, but it's in Chinese: http://www.sudokufans.org/forums/index.php?s=6f82f2002843e02895f319...
Here is list of grids:
1-3 classic sudoku
4 no touch sudoku
5 diagonal-consecutive sudoku
6 the greater sudoku: The small number within two cells stands for the larger of that two.
7 calculate 6 sudoku: Operators of all the neighbors which can get 6 are shown.
8 blackout sudoku
9 arrow sudoku
10 twins sudoku
11 multiplication sudoku
12 pencil marks sudoku Edited by Fred76 2010-09-15 5:12 AM
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-15 5:10 AM
I have a doubt all of a sudden: When I create my grid I thought I had never seen another one, but when I looked at yours, I'm pretty sure I've already solved grid N°55 ! 
Perhaps it's just Alzheimer who knocks on the door !!!  |
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Administrator
Country : India | About Greater sudoku -
We found that the existing image does not fit well with the Flash system we have. So we recreated the image with minor formatting changes. Rules / points remain unchanged.
This is same example as what Fred has shared.
Fill in the grid so that every row, column, and 3x3 box contains the digits 1 through 9.
The small digit between two cells stands for the larger of the two.
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cpickerel
Posts: 14
Country : China | I apologize for not having designed examples for this set of questions, which include new variants. I have another problem of greater sudoku and I'll post it here for exercise.
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cpickerel
Posts: 14
Country : China | |
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debmohanty
Country : India | Bonus 5 points per minute saved, if all puzzles are correct.
If some puzzles are wrong, partial bonus will be awarded based on following table.
The factor is (score - 400 ) / 100 |
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Administrator
Country : India | The Sudoku booklet is available to download. It has 8 pages, each page has 2 Sudokus. |
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utkaarsh
Posts: 89
Country : India | I am not able to find the IB , still see that one puzzle of incomplete killer |
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utkaarsh
Posts: 89
Country : India | |
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purifire
Posts: 460
Country : India |
Utkaarsh,
On the right side of that page, you will find the link sections for the IB and the puzzle booklet.
Rishi |
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debmohanty
Country : India | |
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utkaarsh
Posts: 89
Country : India | got it, deb ...
probably the page was not loading fully earlier due to internet connection
thanks
Edited by utkaarsh 2010-09-24 10:39 PM
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SrikanthB
Posts: 5
Country : India | 11 Sequence sudoku - Can two row-sequences overlap in the original sequence (maintaining the order)?? It is not mentioned in the IB |
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SrikanthB
Posts: 5
Country : India | 11 Sequence sudoku - In other words - will the total number of grey-cells be exactly equal to the total number of digits used (to fill-up; underlined) in the original sequence?? (which means no overlaps) or it could be greater than the total number of digits used of the original sequence ?? (which means there could be overlaps)
Edited by SrikanthB 2010-09-25 1:05 AM
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cpickerel
Posts: 14
Country : China | SrikanthB - 2010-09-25 12:37 AM
11 Sequence sudoku - In other words - will the total number of grey-cells be exactly equal to the total number of digits used (to fill-up; underlined) in the original sequence?? (which means no overlaps) or it could be greater than the total number of digits used of the original sequence ?? (which means there could be overlaps)
The number of total digits of original sequence is greater than the number of gray cells. And, there should NOT be overlaps.
Just like that example. Edited by cpickerel 2010-09-25 6:18 AM
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amitsowani
Posts: 349
Country : India | Just went through the IB.
Some of the variations look to be very interesting.
Loved the concept for Blackout Sum Sudoku and Incomplete Killer.
Looking forward to the test.
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purifire
Posts: 460
Country : India | Now let me put in my 2 cents about the puzzles :)
The puzzles were true to their name of a " HOT POT "
They reminded me of a complete 5 course meal...
The sudokus at the start were like the appetizers, simple and giving you confidence to take in more...
Then came the basic variants which were like the starters whetting the appetite....
Then came the new variants which are real fun and like the main course..
Finally I saved the best for last, incomplete killer, which was the perfect dessert to this hot pot.
Rishi |
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amitsowani
Posts: 349
Country : India | @Rishi
Your description of the puzzles is sounding very inviting.
But will wait patiently till tonight when I will get 2 hours at a stretch to solve.
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cpickerel
Posts: 14
Country : China | purifire - 2010-09-25 1:30 PM
Now let me put in my 2 cents about the puzzles :)
The puzzles were true to their name of a " HOT POT "
They reminded me of a complete 5 course meal...
The sudokus at the start were like the appetizers, simple and giving you confidence to take in more...
Then came the basic variants which were like the starters whetting the appetite....
Then came the new variants which are real fun and like the main course..
Finally I saved the best for last, incomplete killer, which was the perfect dessert to this hot pot.
Rishi
Very glad that you love this HOT POT : )
In fact, you are really a gastronomist. |
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purifire
Posts: 460
Country : India | cpickerel - 2010-09-25 6:58 PM
Very glad that you love this HOT POT :)
In fact, you are really a gastronomist.
LOL .. I enjoy a good meal Chen Cen... but yes I loved this set of puzzles 
and it was really nice meeting you in Bangkok : ) |
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vopani
Posts: 739
Country : India | vopani posted @ 2010-09-25 10:45 PM Very nice and neat puzzles. I enjoyed solving the 'easy' Classics, much to my satisfaction.
Variants were very good. I liked BlackoutSum Sudoku the best :-) |
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motris
Posts: 199
Country : United States | motris posted @ 2010-09-26 3:11 AM An absolutely fabulous test. As I mentioned on my blog, two of the puzzles made my jaw drop to the floor with how well constructed and interesting they were. Thanks for putting these puzzles together! |
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cpickerel
Posts: 14
Country : China | motris - 2010-09-26 3:11 AM
An absolutely fabulous test. As I mentioned on my blog, two of the puzzles made my jaw drop to the floor with how well constructed and interesting they were. Thanks for putting these puzzles together!
Thank you for the compliments, I'm glad that you liked it. |
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Tejal Phatak
Posts: 81
Country : India | The test was excellent as expected! :)
I really liked the classics. though didnt expect them to be that easy. BlackoutSum Sudoku was really good, I liked the Greater Sudoku also. |
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amitsowani
Posts: 349
Country : India | Some really great puzzles in the test.
Had a really smooth run in the classics.
Loved the incomplete killer and the kind of logic involved to solve it.
Could not get around to solve the blackout sum sudoku and will give it a shot at leisure.
Thanks for creating such a wonderful set.
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-26 6:40 PM The food was excellent. Besides, I'm so gourmand that after 2 hours I had not finished eating. |
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cpickerel
Posts: 14
Country : China | Fred76 - 2010-09-26 6:40 PM
The food was excellent. Besides, I'm so gourmand that after 2 hours I had not finished eating.
Which course do you like best?  |
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-26 7:00 PM dessert was not light, but very good |
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cpickerel
Posts: 14
Country : China | purifire - 2010-09-25 7:16 PM
cpickerel - 2010-09-25 6:58 PM
Very glad that you love this HOT POT :)
In fact, you are really a gastronomist.
LOL .. I enjoy a good meal Chen Cen... but yes I loved this set of puzzles
and it was really nice meeting you in Bangkok : )
It was a pleasure to meet you too. You did a great job this time. |
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purifire
Posts: 460
Country : India | cpickerel - 2010-09-26 7:28 PM
It was a pleasure to meet you too. You did a great job this time.
Thankfully I did not leave any blank cells this time
Actually I did but fortunately corrected it before time was up.. lol |
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-26 9:30 PM purifire - 2010-09-26 7:38 PM
Thankfully I did not leave any blank cells this time
Not like me  |
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debmohanty
Country : India | Fred76 - 2010-09-26 9:30 PM
Not like me Bad luck Fred. The 2 missed cells will cost you at least 2 ranks :- ) |
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purifire
Posts: 460
Country : India | Fred76 - 2010-09-26 9:30 PM
Not like me
Ooops.... Fred, I thought leaving blank cells was my prerogative...sorry to hear that.............. |
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-26 10:38 PM purifire - 2010-09-26 9:33 PM
Ooops.... Fred, I thought leaving blank cells was my prerogative...sorry to hear that..............
Usually I don't make too many mistakes of this kind  . This time I just loose 15 points, I can live with that |
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-26 10:46 PM debmohanty - 2010-09-26 9:33 PM
Fred76 - 2010-09-26 9:30 PM
Not like me Bad luck Fred. The 2 missed cells will cost you at least 2 ranks :- )
I hope they are 2 nice people |
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forcolin
Posts: 172
Country : ITALY | hi
good contest as usual
there is something i do not understand
I submitted my solution to diagram #. I made a mistake in copying (in fact I copied the last 3 digits fromthe upper row). I clicked on "submit"
Immediately after I noticed the mistake, amended the 3 cells, and sumbitted again. However the result shown in the table is the first submission (wrong)
What is the problem? Perhaps did I NOT click stongly enough on the SUBMIT button the second time? Or there is a routine which saves only the first submission?
Could you have a look?
thank you
stefano
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Administrator
Country : India | forcolin - 2010-09-27 4:27 AM
hi
good contest as usual
there is something i do not understand
I submitted my solution to diagram #. I made a mistake in copying (in fact I copied the last 3 digits fromthe upper row). I clicked on "submit"
Immediately after I noticed the mistake, amended the 3 cells, and sumbitted again. However the result shown in the table is the first submission (wrong)
What is the problem? Perhaps did I NOT click stongly enough on the SUBMIT button the second time? Or there is a routine which saves only the first submission?
Could you have a look?
thank you
stefano
Hi Stefano, the only possibility I can think of is when you submitted the 2nd time, your 120 minutes were over. Is that the case? |
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Administrator
Country : India | Congratulations to Thomas, Rishi and Michael for topping in Hot Pot.
Looks like everyone liked the dishes :-) Many thanks to the authors for the nice Sudoku set.
133 out of 158 participants got non-zero scores.
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forcolin
Posts: 172
Country : ITALY | no, i did it immediately after (and there were 20 minutes at least to go)
stefano |
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Administrator
Country : India | Many thanks to Ours brun who tested all the Sudokus for LMI. |
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Administrator
Country : India | There was a Fed-Sudoku Party this weekend, and they also enjoyed Sudoku HotPot test offline.
Thanks to mtronic who collected the results and sent in quick time.
There were 17 participants. In the score page their country is marked as *Fed-Party* |
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rakesh_rai
Posts: 774
Country : India | Thanks to TThSieh, jcvb, cpickerel, Ours brun for coming up with excellent sudokus.
I am not a big fan of classics and diagonal, so I tried only a few in the end. Had I seen Tejal's comments before starting the test, perhaps I would have tried them all first.
Among the variations, the PI sudoku, surprisingly, turned out to be the toughest - I think one reason was the difficulty in marking the numbers online. Also, I was not totally clear (initially) whether the 3 in the second row would be part of the sequence or not. Then I concluded it must be part of the sequence and an intended starting point for solving. Among the "expected to be tough" variations, I found the Blackout sum sudoku very easy, as compared to the points allotted. Incomplete killer had a beautiful piece of logic going for it, as mentioned earlier ("jaw-dropping") and I am glad I tried it at the start. If I had tried it towards the end, it would not have got done. Here, I wasted quite some time in identifying that the top left 2-cell box must have sum 12 or above. After that, it was easier. As for outside sudoku, I could not give it a fair attempt in the time given. Again, that puzzle could perhaps have been better solved offline. |
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debmohanty
Country : India | The Incomplete Killer indeed had a great piece of logic. May be it will help if we can have a write up on the logic. Any takers? |
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purifire
Posts: 460
Country : India | debmohanty - 2010-09-27 9:01 AM
The Incomplete Killer indeed had a great piece of logic. May be it will help if we can have a write up on the logic. Any takers?
I can do it if you wish Deb... I really loved the concept and the logic behind it : ) |
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debmohanty
Country : India | purifire - 2010-09-27 9:05 AM
I can do it if you wish Deb... I really loved the concept and the logic behind it :) please do it. |
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neerajmehrotra
Posts: 328
Country : India | Heartiest congratulations to all the winners......and special congratulations to Rishi for coming second only to Thomas.......Grt job...
I missed it Thanx to BSNL....no internet for last 3 days......... |
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purifire
Posts: 460
Country : India | neerajmehrotra - 2010-09-27 10:36 AM
Heartiest congratulations to all the winners......and special congratulations to Rishi for coming second only to Thomas.......Grt job...
I missed it Thanx to BSNL....no internet for last 3 days.........
Thanks Neeraj... I seriously didnt expect to see my name there.... When I completed I thought atleast a top 5 finish |
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debmohanty
Country : India | PI Sudoku (Sequence) was the least solved one.
Was it just too difficult OR instructions were not clear? |
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purifire
Posts: 460
Country : India | debmohanty - 2010-09-27 2:37 PM
PI Sudoku (Sequence) was the least solved one.
Was it just too difficult OR instructions were not clear?
It was clear but I presume people overlooked the fact that in every row even if grey cells are not connected, the numbers have to be in sequential order from the given sequence... in my discussions with players, they assumed every individual grey cell will have an individual number from the sequence.
Rishi |
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-27 3:18 PM For me, it was clear, but I wasn't very comfortable with that grid. I filled sequence for second row, and then I thought I'll loose too much time, so I leave it for another grid.
Moreover, I didn't print the grid, and thought when I began the grid that it would be easier to solve it on paper. I only printed the last 3 grids: blackout because I wanted to write missing digits next to the grid; Incomplete killer and outside sudoku because there were some clues outside the grid. |
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David McNeill
Posts: 63
Country : United Kingdom | Deb,
I didn't solve the Sequence Sudoku during the 2 hours, as I couldn't see a logical process. Afterwards, I solved it reasonably quickly by guessing some of the longer sequences.
David McNeill. |
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-27 8:36 PM debmohanty - 2010-09-26 9:33 PM
Fred76 - 2010-09-26 9:30 PM
Not like me Bad luck Fred. The 2 missed cells will cost you at least 2 ranks :- )
Finally, I loose just 1 place.
Interesting fact: the top 10 all come from a different country.
About grids.
Classics were fair and not too hard (I don't overcome technics to solve tough grids  and I don't like bifurcation ), but not uninteresting.
Variants were very interesting:
Incomplete killer was very fine to solve. It was the scarecrow of the tournament . I really liked it and was happy to be able to solve it during time.
Usually, I don't like when there are lot of rules for a single grid, but outside sudoku was so well constructed, that the way different rules interact was very interesting.You had to find the path to solve it, every extra-rule was significant !
Blackout sum is a nice discovery as variant of blackout !
I liked symetry of diagonal and greater sudoku.
Inequality was interesting, as it was not like "standard" inequality (which has every <> marked and no digit inside the grid ). It was more about logic than routine to follow (place the 9th, the 8th, or the 1th, the 2th... ).
I like bush variation. It was one of the easiest variant in the test.
I don't solved 1234+567+89 (I don't like these variants. All these mental calculations overheat my musician's brain  ) and Pi sudoku. Perhaps this evening... Edited by Fred76 2010-09-27 8:38 PM
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motris
Posts: 199
Country : United States | motris posted @ 2010-09-27 8:53 PM The visual theme of pi sudoku was very nice, but as David mentioned it was a puzzle where it was much easier to solve by guessing the long sequences at the bottom than using logic to know what went where so I skipped over it in my first pass. I was two bifurcations deep (for the 3 and the 4 digit sequences on the bottom) in my notation, but the first things I tried worked probably because the number of usable sequences is so low. So I think the challenge of breaking into the puzzle may have been the biggest factor, but I could also see confusion about the instructions keeping others from trying it too.
Edited by motris 2010-09-27 8:54 PM
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detuned
Posts: 152
Country : United Kingdom | detuned posted @ 2010-09-28 1:31 AM Fred76 - 2010-09-27 3:36 PM
I don't solved 1234+567+89 (I don't like these variants. All these mental calculations overheat my musician's brain ) and Pi sudoku. Perhaps this evening...
Agreed - I can't for the life of me work out how to solve these with anything approaching elegance and fluidity, or even without scribbling down lots of sums in what is essentially trial and error. I have a mess of notes and calculation by the side of my printed page, and I'm impressed by anyone who claims to solve these relatively cleanly. I'd like to know how it's done! Ditto calculo-doku or whatever the current Krtek cup is.
N.B. as a maths researcher you should take it as given that my arithmetic is lazy and prone to all sorts of errors ; ) |
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Fred76
Posts: 337
Country : Switzerland | Fred76 posted @ 2010-09-28 2:20 AM Pi sudoku solved.
1234+567+89 solved too. Not very cleanly  , but perhaps I didn't thought enough about logic of these puzzles (like: when the last digit of a sum is 5, sum of the 3 units is 15 (5 or 25 isn't possible ),... )
I didn't like calcdoku, but I think I'm in progress . |
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amitsowani
Posts: 349
Country : India | Fred76 - 2010-09-28 2:20 AM
Pi sudoku solved.
1234+567+89 solved too. Not very cleanly , but perhaps I didn't thought enough about logic of these puzzles (like: when the last digit of a sum is 5, sum of the 3 units is 15 (5 or 25 isn't possible ),... )
I didn't like calcdoku, but I think I'm in progress .
Quite often the 1000's place column of 1234 gets solved immediately. |
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debmohanty
Country : India | Fred76 - 2010-09-27 8:36 PM
Interesting fact: the top 10 all come from a different country.
That is a very interesting observation indeed.
Thanks for pointing out.
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LMI September Test - Sudoku Hot Pot
